wOBA vs OPS

[SirKodiak]

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/inde...e_bias_in_ops/

Continuing my bashing of Bengie Molina, allow me to show you how his terrible OBP can be quite detrimental. Bengie Molina posted a .727 OPS in 2009, which isn’t very good. Ryan Theriot managed to post an even lower OPS of .712 in 2009. He must be the inferior offensive player. Wrong. Molina’s wOBA is actually .308 to Theriot’s .318. Though Theriot slugged 73 points less than Molina, his OBP was 58 points higher, and, wOBA shows us that his 58 OBP points to Molina’s 73 slugging points were actually worth an additional10 points in wOBA. This is just a quick example and a good way to illustrate just how much Molina’s extraordinary out making skills truly do hurt his team, offensively of course.

[Jeffy25]

learning

[BenFink]

It makes sense to weight OBA more than it currently is in OPS.
OPS has always seemed to me to be a quick, easy way of comparing players.

I don't particularly like the example of Molina vs Theriot. A 15 point OPS difference has never struck me as a big deal.

[actionjackson]

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/inde...e_bias_in_ops/

Thanks SirKodiak. I think you and HGM lead these boards in digging up cool baseball stuff and helping to edu-meh-cate the rest of us.

[Jeffy25]

It makes sense to weight OBA more than it currently is in OPS.
OPS has always seemed to me to be a quick, easy way of comparing players.

I don't particularly like the example of Molina vs Theriot. A 15 point OPS difference has never struck me as a big deal.

I agree.

and I don't like how speed players are under rated when it comes to OPS. If I find a high singles hitter who can steal bases like Ichiro, it isn't that fair to them. Since OPS cares about Slugging just as much as it does OBA, a guy like Nick Johnson may get on as much as Ichiro, but it doesn't mean that he is more valuable then Ichiro, especially in my leadoff spot. If my rant makes any sense.

I prefer OPS over general offensive stats, and look at it very broadly when evaluating a player. I want a certain OPS number in different spots in my lineup for example....with different rates for OBA and SLUG in different spots. OPS doesn't mean much to me for a leadoff guy though, but it does for my numbers 2-5 hitters

[actionjackson]

I agree.

and I don't like how speed players are under rated when it comes to OPS. If I find a high singles hitter who can steal bases like Ichiro, it isn't that fair to them. Since OPS cares about Slugging just as much as it does OBA, a guy like Nick Johnson may get on as much as Ichiro, but it doesn't mean that he is more valuable then Ichiro, especially in my leadoff spot. If my rant makes any sense.

I prefer OPS over general offensive stats, and look at it very broadly when evaluating a player. I want a certain OPS number in different spots in my lineup for example....with different rates for OBA and SLUG in different spots. OPS doesn't mean much to me for a leadoff guy though, but it does for my numbers 2-5 hitters

May I present: wRC+, which is partially derived from wOBA and incorporates SB and CS as well.

[Jeffy25]

May I present: wRC+, which is partially derived from wOBA and incorporates SB and CS as well.

Yes, i prefer that stat

I just didn't say it.

[SirKodiak]

Just to be clear, wOBA includes SB/CS.

wOBA > OPS
wRC+ > OPS+