1st place in ERA+
Funkin' 4 Jamaica
1st place in ERA+
Now run and tell ya mama 'bout that!
Song of Solomon 5:4
Ah...Originally Posted by SoulMan
Registered User
quit being a troll
o
The BBWAA began awarding the Cy Young award in 1956. From then through the 1966 season, the BBWAA awarded just one award, given to the best pitcher in the entire MLB (as determined by the voters). From 1967 to the modern day, the BBWAA has awarded two awards per season, one to each league. In all, they've awarded 95 Cy Young's.
For this comparison, I've taken both my winners for the 1967-2008 period, as well as my MLB choice for the 1956-1966 period. I agreed with the BBWAA a total of 56 times, or about 59% of the time.
As previously stated, I'm going to continue awarding Cy Young awards to each league, along with the MVPs. After completing 1931, the first year in which the BBWAA handed out MVP awards, I will run a comparison, like I just did for the Cy Young, to see how often I agreed with them on those decisions. I will then continue my awards back to 1901, at which point I may decide to go back further, or cut off there. Whether I end at 1901 or earlier, I will then compile a list of all award winners, and rank them by the number of awards they won. For the MVP, I am also thinking of compiling a breakdown of the number of awards own by each defensive position.
Unregistered User
No way... That award belongs to Strawberry or Hershiser. I'd put Clark third.
But I agree, it's forgotten sometimes just how great a player Will Clark was.
o
Clark: 162 games, .282/.386/.508, 160 OPS+, 29 HR, 109 RBI, 9 SB/1 CS
Strawberry: 153 games, .269/.366/.545. 165 OPS+, 39 HR, 101 RBI, 29 SB/14 CS
I don't think Hershiser's year was anywhere close to the level a starting pitcher has to pitch at to get the MVP, particularly given there was multiple excellent position player candidates, so let's just look at those two.
Clark has a slight advantage in games, as he appeared in every game for the Giants. Strawberry obviously has the advantage in power. Clark's got the advantage in not making outs. Baseball Prospectus's Equivalent Average, which uses the same scale as batting average and takes into account all aspects of hitting plus stolen bases/caught stealing and adjusts for park, has Will Clark at .339 and Strawberry at .335. Very close, slight edge to Clark which I would agree with, even though I hadn't looked at EQA until just now. OBP is more valuable than SLG, so the relative difference between their OBP's makes up for the relative difference between their SLG's, and I think it put Clark ever so slightly above.
Strawberry stole more bases, but did so at a terrible percentage, while Clark stole just 9 but only got caught once. Unfortunately, I don't have any other baserunning metrics from that period, so I'll call it a push on the bases.
Fielding-wise, Clark comes out, in Fielding Runs, as 4 above average and 18 above replacement. Strawberry comes out as 3 above average and 19 above replacement. (Strawberry was slightly less above average, but slightly more above replacement, because the replacement right fielder is a more valuable defender than the replacement first basemen). Close enough to call that a push.
Given that they were damn close in nearly everything, I gave it to Clark for appearing in all 162 games, really. It was INCREDIBLY close. I disagree that it "No way" should go to Clark, obviously. I certainly see why you disagree with my choice to give it to Clark, because both players have excellent arguments, but I don't think it's as obvious as you seemingly made it out to be.
o
1955:
AL MVP: Mickey Mantle
NL MVP: Willie Mays
AL Cy: Billy Pierce
NL Cy: Robin Roberts
The BBWAA MVP's both went to catchers - Yogi Berra in the AL and Roy Campanella in the NL. Both had strong seasons, but Mantle and Mays put up a regular season for them, which is part of the reason, I think, neither fared well in many MVP's. These awesome performances were expected from them. One of two things had to happen for them to get really strong consideration - they had to go above and beyond their regular numbers, or the league itself had to be relatively weak. For Mantle, this is his 8th consecutive HGM MVP, a truly remarkable run, doubling the amount of consecutive MVP's that any other player has won.
I gave the AL Cy Young award to Billy Pierce. Despite just getting over the 200 inning mark, he put up silly numbers - a 201 ERA+. In the NL, I gave it to Robin Roberts, who led the league in innings by a wide margin while putting up a 121 ERA+.
o
1954:
AL MVP: Bobby Avila
NL MVP: Willie Mays
AL Cy: Mike Garcia
NL Cy: Johnny Antonelli
Bobby Avila breaks Mickey Mantle's record streak of HGM MVP's. Yogi Berra was given the AL MVP by the BBWAA in 1954, as well as 1955, but I've got Avila over him this year. Avila combined excellent offense and superb second base defense. Ted Williams would've gotten this award if it wasn't for defense factoring into the equation, because he had a truly awesome offensive season, and nobody was all that close. I agreed with the BBWAA on Willie Mays in the NL, although Duke Snider would've taken it if it wasn't for Willie Mays's defensive advantage.
The AL Cy Young battle had a few pitchers separated by barely a hair. In the end I went with the guy that won the ERA+ title, Mike Garcia. My NL Cy Young pick, Johnny Antonelli, placed 3rd in the BBWAA NL MVP balloting on the strength of a 2.30 ERA (177 ERA+) in 259 innings.
Im watching you
This might sound corny but if I had one wish, it would be to see the games these players played back in the 50's and prior. I think it would be something amazing to see. Ok I am drunk, but get over it, compared to a lot of people I am of drinking age.
o
1953:
AL MVP: Al Rosen
NL MVP: Roy Campanella
AL Cy: Billy Pierce
NL Cy: Robin Roberts
Al Rosen in the AL was an easy call, so the BBWAA and I agreed on that one. I also agreed on the NL with Roy Campanella, but nearly gave my pick to Eddie Mathews.
My AL Cy Young went to Billy Pierce, who takes home his 2nd HGM Cy. Pierce was 2nd in the league with a 148 ERA+, while finishing 3rd with 271 innings and leading the league in strikeouts with 186. In the NL, it was close between Warren Spahn, who had a 188 ERA+ and Robin Roberts, who had a 152. Roberts bested Spahn by roughly 80 innings, though, a gap in quantity that's hard to overlook.
o
1952:
AL MVP: Bobby Shantz
NL MVP: Jackie Robinson
AL Cy: Bobby Shantz
NL Cy: Robin Roberts
I agreed with the BBWAA on giving Bobby Shantz, a pitcher, the AL MVP, and thus, by extension, he gains my Cy Young as well. Larry Doby and Mickey Mantle were both neck and neck in the position player department, and it was really close, so I looked a bit deeper. Shantz was in the upper third of pitchers that year in terms of hitting, which, while a small part, does have value. I used that to give him a slight nudge and agree with the BBWAA.
In the NL, the BBWAA had a close 3 way race with both the winner Hank Sauer and Joe Black receiving 8 first-place votes, and Robin Roberts, my clear NL Cy Young pick, receiving 7. I went, though, for Jackie Robinson, who led the league in on-base percentage while providing excellent defense up the middle.
o
1951:
AL MVP: Ted Williams
NL MVP: Roy Campanella
AL Cy: Early Wynn
NL Cy: Sal Maglie
This was one of Ted's lesser seasons, and he didn't get much love from the BBWAA, finishing 13th in the voting. However, he still had a fantastic season, and nobody was close in terms of offense. Defense closes the gap a little between the BBWAA winner Yogi Berra, Larry Doby, and him, but not enough for me to look over Ted. I agreed with the BBWAA's selection of Roy Campanella for the NL MVP, again.
For the AL Cy Young, I went with Early Wynn who pitched 274.1 innings with a 126 ERA+. Sal Maglie was my NL pick after pitching 298 innings with a 134 ERA+. Robin Roberts was a close second.
Song of Solomon 5:4
Why is every comment I make considered trolling?
o
1950:
AL MVP: Phil Rizzuto
NL MVP: Eddie Stanky
AL Cy: Ned Garver
NL Cy: Robin Roberts
Phil Rizzuto's 1950 MVP is often disputed, but I think it was deserved. He had his peak offensive season, while combining that with excellent defense at shortstop. Combine it with a weak class of players all around, and he comes out on top. Al Rosen, who finished 17th in the BBWAA voting, was a close second for me.
The NL MVP went to reliever Jim Konstanty. I'm giving it to Eddie Stanky of the Giants. The slick-fielding second basemen led the league with an awesome .460 on-base percentage.
The AL Cy Young goes to Ned Garver, which will probably be one of my more controversial picks. Garver posted a 146 ERA+ in 260 innings. He played for the St. Louis Browns, a pretty bad team. In 1951, the following year, he overcame his team's 102 losses to post a 20-12 record, which earned him a 2nd place finish in the MVP voting. In 1950, though, luck wasn't on his side, and despite an appreciably better year, his record was a lowly 13-18, while his team went 58-96.
I'm giving the NL Cy Young to Robin Roberts, his fourth HGM Cy. He had a 135 ERA+ in over 300 innings. He also had a very legitimate argument in 1951, which would've given him a 5th, but I had Sal Maglie just a tad above him.
o
Because you say some pretty outrageous things that seem to be made for no reason other than to elicit a reaction.Why is every comment I make considered trolling?
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