Wbc

[dps]

Heh--the Netherlands didn't want Andruw Jones on their roster.

[200tang]

Go Mexico

For my view on players/owners. I don't know how many of you know Latin people, but my dad was Mexican and so I grew up around a lot of Latinos and they have a ton of pride. I've also known quite a few people who were born in Japan and my friends had about 6 Japanese foreign exchange students in high school and they have a ton of pride as well. I'm not sure exactly what kind of 'backlash' you would get from a player if you denied them the right to play in the WBC, but depending on who it was I could imagine it could be a somewhat significant media distraction. Personally I love the WBC, it advances baseball internationally and hopefully we'll see a few players from other countries in this WBC make their transition to the MLB in the near future. They've also reworked the rules quite a bit this WBC to help limit injuries. For pitchers they put a pitch limit in for each round. I believe the first round is something like 65 pitches max.

I can understand an owner not wanting their player to get hurt in the WBC though since you're paying them. Although I think saying an owner doesn't care about the WBC is a bit from the truth though. For one you get to see how other international players fare against MLB talent and possibly try and sign them which helps bring fans in to the park. Ichiro/Daisuke/etc... Another would be if they played in your stadium. I know this year they're playing in San Diego and LA. I think LA will be have the semi and finals if I remember correctly. I'm not 100% if the teams bring in any revenue from their stadium being used, but even if they don't it would still be cool. I'm sure the teams would be allowed to sell their own merchandise/food inside the stadium even if they took 0 dollars away from tickets. And to say owners only see baseball from a business standpoint seems a bit far fetched as well. I think they mainly see it from a business standpoint, but I also believe they have to love baseball to want to own a team. And the WBC can only do good for baseball internationally.

Now would it suck to lose your star player in a tournament when your team is ready this year to win it all ? Yes. I think there should be some sort of paycut if you do get injured in the WBC, although I sort of doubt that ever happens.

It's a tough issue because on one hand the fans and players love it and to an extent the owners do, but on the other hand there is always that risk that your star players get injured and are out for the whole season. I really don't think anything will be resolved with this whole issue until a major player gets a season ending injury of some sort or even career ending. I think if say Albert Pujols went down this WBC and came back and never got back on track that would get the ball rolling, but until then I'm not sure if this issue will be addressed.

[dickay]

Go Mexico

For my view on players/owners. I don't know how many of you know Latin people, but my dad was Mexican and so I grew up around a lot of Latinos and they have a ton of pride. I've also known quite a few people who were born in Japan and my friends had about 6 Japanese foreign exchange students in high school and they have a ton of pride as well. I'm not sure exactly what kind of 'backlash' you would get from a player if you denied them the right to play in the WBC, but depending on who it was I could imagine it could be a somewhat significant media distraction. Personally I love the WBC, it advances baseball internationally and hopefully we'll see a few players from other countries in this WBC make their transition to the MLB in the near future. They've also reworked the rules quite a bit this WBC to help limit injuries. For pitchers they put a pitch limit in for each round. I believe the first round is something like 65 pitches max.

I can understand an owner not wanting their player to get hurt in the WBC though since you're paying them. Although I think saying an owner doesn't care about the WBC is a bit from the truth though. For one you get to see how other international players fare against MLB talent and possibly try and sign them which helps bring fans in to the park. Ichiro/Daisuke/etc... Another would be if they played in your stadium. I know this year they're playing in San Diego and LA. I think LA will be have the semi and finals if I remember correctly. I'm not 100% if the teams bring in any revenue from their stadium being used, but even if they don't it would still be cool. I'm sure the teams would be allowed to sell their own merchandise/food inside the stadium even if they took 0 dollars away from tickets. And to say owners only see baseball from a business standpoint seems a bit far fetched as well. I think they mainly see it from a business standpoint, but I also believe they have to love baseball to want to own a team. And the WBC can only do good for baseball internationally.

Now would it suck to lose your star player in a tournament when your team is ready this year to win it all ? Yes. I think there should be some sort of paycut if you do get injured in the WBC, although I sort of doubt that ever happens.

It's a tough issue because on one hand the fans and players love it and to an extent the owners do, but on the other hand there is always that risk that your star players get injured and are out for the whole season. I really don't think anything will be resolved with this whole issue until a major player gets a season ending injury of some sort or even career ending. I think if say Albert Pujols went down this WBC and came back and never got back on track that would get the ball rolling, but until then I'm not sure if this issue will be addressed.

Well said.

Sabathia & Tex are not playing last I heard and don't think for a second it isn't because they signed with NYY. NYY are on the record of not wanting their players to play.

[filihok]

http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/...ster_released/

Catchers: Ariel Pestano* (Villa Clara), Rolando Meriño (Santiago de Cuba), Yosvany Peraza (Pinar del Río)

Outfielders: Frederich Cepeda* (Sancti Spíritus), Alfredo Despaigne (Granma), Yoennis Céspedes (Granma), Leonys Martin (Villa Clara), Leslie Anderson* (Camagüey)

Infielders: Joan Carlos Pedroso* (Las Tunas), Alexander Mayeta (Industriales), Yulieski Gourriel* (Sancti Spíritus), Eduardo Paret* (Villa Clara), Michel Enríquez* (Isla de la Juventud), Héctor Olivera (Santiago de Cuba), Luis Miguel Navas (Santiago de Cuba)

Pitchers: Right-Handers: Pedro Luis Lazo* (Pinar del Río), Norge Luis Vera (Santiago de Cuba), Yuniesky Maya* (Pinar del Río), Luis Miguel Rodríguez (Holguín), Miguel Lahera (Habana Province), Vladimir García (Ciego de Avila), Ismel Jiménez (Sancti Spíritus), Yolexis Ulacia (Villa Clara), Ciro Silvino Licea (Granma), Dany Betancourt (Santiago de Cuba). Left-Handers: Aroldis Chapman (Holguín), Yunieski González* (Habana Province), Norberto González* (Cienfuegos)

Coaches: Higinio Vélez (Manager), Benito Camacho (General Manager), Francisco Escaurido, Carlos Cepero, Lourdes Gourriel, Pedro Pérez, Eduardo Martin, Humberto Arrieta, Jorge Fuentes.

The WBC Roster for Cuba

[Side thought]Evelyn...Mmmm....[/Side thought]

[Rongar]

New Japanese prospect...

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/20/sp..._r=1&th&emc=th

[defense]

Players owe their teams, owners, and front office staff all the loyalty that they get from them in return.

When your job is paying you millions, or even hundreds of thousands, of dollars, you OWE them your loyalty.

If I was being paid to play baseball, I would not risk screwing my employers who pay me well by risking injury in the WBC.

[haveacigar]

When your job is paying you millions, or even hundreds of thousands, of dollars, you OWE them your loyalty.

If I was being paid to play baseball, I would not risk screwing my employers who pay me well by risking injury in the WBC.

Like I said, players owe them all the loyalty that they get from the owners in return.

This whole argument could be settled if Selig decided to grow a pair once in his life, got the owners together, and say "Look, MLB is dedicated to the WBC, and you can either get on board or get out of the way." It's ridiculous to have owners impeding the progress of a league initiative like this.

[reflections]

Go Netherlands.

You know they won't have PED's, maybe just some mood altering.

And the arguement that because they are being paid millions they shouldn't go..I'm just glad the original Dream Team didn't think that.
Baseball needs all the good pub it can get, and for the reason for players not to play in the WBC to be money. It's weak.
I would give a pass to player coming off a injury though.

[Arctic Blast]

Go Netherlands.

You know they won't have PED's, maybe just some mood altering.

And the arguement that because they are being paid millions they shouldn't go..I'm just glad the original Dream Team didn't think that.
Baseball needs all the good pub it can get, and for the reason for players not to play in the WBC to be money. It's weak.
I would give a pass to player coming off a injury though.

It's weak...until your team's season gets wrecked before it starts because your star pitcher messes up his throwing shoulder and your best outfielder blows out his knee playing in the WBC.

[dps]

When your job is paying you millions, or even hundreds of thousands, of dollars, you OWE them your loyalty.

If I was being paid to play baseball, I would not risk screwing my employers who pay me well by risking injury in the WBC.

They have written contracts--if there's nothing in a player's contract that states that he won't play in the WBC, that player doesn't owe it to the team to not play.

And I agree with haveacigar that the Commissioner needs to keep the owners from obstructing the WBC. If he's not going to do that, he should abandon the project.

[kenny1234]

They have written contracts--if there's nothing in a player's contract that states that he won't play in the WBC, that player doesn't owe it to the team to not play.

I'm sure that every player has a clause in their contract about not playing baseball for any other team or in any other situation. And even without that, they would be required to be at spring training during the time period of the WBC - so they need to alter the terms of the contract to play. It would be interesting if a player stated that their next contract would specifically include a release to play in the WBC. Would their contract value actually change?

[haveacigar]

I'm sure that every player has a clause in their contract about not playing baseball for any other team or in any other situation. And even without that, they would be required to be at spring training during the time period of the WBC - so they need to alter the terms of the contract to play. It would be interesting if a player stated that their next contract would specifically include a release to play in the WBC. Would their contract value actually change?

Dude, the WBC is official MLB business, this has absolutely no relevance to any contract clause regarding "not playing baseball in other situations." C'mon now.

It should be incumbent on the owners that sometimes they have to put up with these kinds of inconveniences at the behest of the league. You know, in exchange for the right to be able to own a major league franchise. Since when do MLB owners have to be placated 24/7 anyway? That idea is what led to the strike in 94.

[filihok]

When your job is paying you millions, or even hundreds of thousands, of dollars, you OWE them your loyalty.

If I was being paid to play baseball, I would not risk screwing my employers who pay me well by risking injury in the WBC.

I disagree with this 1000's of times over.

It's no different than any other type of contractual relationship. Just because it is for more money. I've done contract work myself. Sometimes for bigger amounts, sometimes for small amounts like $10 an hour or (i think a few times) for $2.50. Whatever loyalty I have should be my decision.

Your employer doesn't own you just because they support you financially.

[200tang]

I disagree with this 1000's of times over.

It's no different than any other type of contractual relationship. Just because it is for more money. I've done contract work myself. Sometimes for bigger amounts, sometimes for small amounts like $10 an hour or (i think a few times) for $2.50. Whatever loyalty I have should be my decision.

Your employer doesn't own you just because they support you financially.

totally agree, I've never understood why people think players should have to be loyal to teams. Face it, no matter how much you're loved by the fans if you're getting in to your 30's and figure to start declining and there's the next big thing behind you in the minors your team won't hesitate to trade you or let you go during the off-season. That doesn't seem fair to me that the player must have 100% loyalty, but the club can do whatever they want and loyalty never gets questioned.

The only player I can think of who is immune to this would be Derek Jeter.

[BINGLEBOP]

I agree completely with filihok and 200tang. A player should be loyal to their team simply because the team is paying them?

This is the same team that has no problem with uprooting a player's family by trading him to another team on a moment's notice because they need somebody who fits the roster's needs more. If they asked a player's loyalty, I'd hope that they would give it in return in that scenario, but that's not how it works. It's a business. Baseball has always been a business and always will be, and "loyalty" is not required in business relationships. Both sides can co-exist and get along fine without having to be loyal to one another.