What now for the NYY?

[HoustonGM]

Was it Wang who got jerked off in the Yankee bullpen according to David Cone?

That was Ian Kennedy's wang, unfortunately.

[koolzach1]

In other news, Cliff Lee owned The Best Pitcher in Baseball today.

Wait... so Wang is allowed to actually hit and pitch?!

If not (which I am pretty dang sure that he is not allowed to), then Wang didn't get "owned". Dude gave up 3 runs in 7 innings of work. In a night where he didn't have his best stuff, he still had a quality start.

Cliff Lee sucks anyways, and will eventually start sucking eggs.

[HoustonGM]

Wait... so Wang is allowed to actually hit and pitch?!

Dude, so you're finally starting to see my point?

If not (which I am pretty dang sure that he is not allowed to), then Wang didn't get "owned". Dude gave up 3 runs in 7 innings of work. In a night where he didn't have his best stuff, he still had a quality start.

HOW DO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THIS....and then still use wins to evaluate pitchers? I said Lee owned Wang in order to show you how ridiculous it is to assign the outcome of the game as a Win or a Loss to a pitcher, when more than just the pitcher contributes to the win and the loss. Cliff Lee owned the Yankees lineup. Chien-Ming Wang pitched a very good game but got no help from the offense. This is why using wins and losses to evaluate pitchers is stupid.

Cliff Lee sucks anyways, and will eventually start sucking eggs.

Cliff Lee doesn't suck. He sucked for a season while being plagued by injuries. He was solid in 2005 and 2006.

[RickD]

Yankees! Yankees!

[koolzach1]

Dude, so you're finally starting to see my point?

HOW DO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THIS....and then still use wins to evaluate pitchers? I said Lee owned Wang in order to show you how ridiculous it is to assign the outcome of the game as a Win or a Loss to a pitcher, when more than just the pitcher contributes to the win and the loss. Cliff Lee owned the Yankees lineup. Chien-Ming Wang pitched a very good game but got no help from the offense. This is why using wins and losses to evaluate pitchers is stupid.

Cliff Lee doesn't suck. He sucked for a season while being plagued by injuries. He was solid in 2005 and 2006.

Well, I am just saying that Wang did not get "owned"... He pitched a very solid game for not having his best stuff.

Lee is average, really.

[HoustonGM]

Well, I am just saying that Wang did not get "owned"... He pitched a very solid game for not having his best stuff.

And I'm not saying he didn't, but if you're going to use wins and losses to evaluate players, than you also have to admit that Wang lost the game and thus didn't do well. Or, you could just stop using wins and losses to determine whose a better pitcher.

Lee is average, really.

For his career. This year, he's been otherworldly.

[HoustonGM]

From Rotoworld:

Just in case you thought his deal with the devil was only for April, Lee turned in another outstanding effort, striking out seven and walking zero while scattering six hits. His ERA is now down to an amazing 0.81 and Lee's 39/2 K/BB ratio in 44 2/3 innings suggests that he's been anything but lucky. There's plenty reason to remain somewhat skeptical given Lee's horrendous 2007 and unspectacular track record, but so far at least he's putting together a legitimate breakout season.

[RickD]

I admit Wang lost the game and did not do well. I also admit the Yankees are the greatest team EVER!!!! Yankees!

[HoustonGM]

I admit Wang lost the game and did not do well

How is 3 runs in 7 innings not pitching well?

[koolzach1]

Wang did well, and still lost the game... It happens. I will still use wins/losses as a key piece to evaluating a pitcher. Other stats do come into affect to, I won't lie, but when the win/loss record is good, the pitcher generally put up solid stats... Basically:

19 Wins = solid all around stats also (at least MOST of the time).

[HoustonGM]

Wang did well, and still lost the game...

No. The YANKEES lost the game.

I will still use wins/losses as a key piece to evaluating a pitcher. Other stats do come into affect to, I won't lie, but when the win/loss record is good, the pitcher generally put up solid stats... Basically:

19 Wins = solid all around stats also (at least MOST of the time).

Yes, generally, you can't win that much without being a good pitcher. And Chien-Ming Wang is a very good pitcher. But to say he's the best in the league because he has like 4 more wins in the last few seasons than some other pitchers is silly. You have to acknowledge the fact that he's on one of the best offensive teams in the major leagues, and that other, better pitchers are on worse offensive teams and don't get good support and thus don't get the wins. Wins and losses are dependent on the offensive support. They tell you nothing about how a pitcher pitched. You can make some generalizations about it (ie. to win 19 games you have to have pitched well), but it's downright silly to say that a pitcher that won 19 games is better than a pitcher that won 16 (Brandon Webb was better than Chien-Ming Wang in both 2006 and 2007, but won 16 and 18 games).

[RickD]

Yankees! Yankees!

[HoustonGM]

This is something else I absolutely cannot understand about the crowd of baseball fans that still like to rely on wins and losses for pitchers. They seem to acknowledge the gigantic problems with the stat...yet still base evaluations on it...

[koolzach1]

Lol @ Rick!

A true fellow fan... Actually I am starting to wonder about some of our fans... They really hate this year's team. I keep telling them that we will make the playoffs, and in the off season sign Tex for 1B, C.C. as our #1b, and a couple of RP (hopefully).

[RickD]

Well I do love the Yanks koolzach1 and glad you do as well. My only disappointments with the team are Giambi and Hughes! Kennedy I am ambivalent about.

Anyway I will keep popping in and cheering for the Yanks if for no other reason than to tweak the non-Yank fans.