Sabathia wins AL Cy Young

[Tannhauser]

From: http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/spor...ts&oref=slogin

C.C. Sabathia won the AL Cy Young Award on Tuesday, beating out several worthy contenders by a comfortable margin and becoming the first Cleveland pitcher in 35 years to earn the honor.

The Indians ace received 19 of 28 first-place votes and finished with 119 points in balloting by the Baseball Writers' Association of America. Boston's Josh Beckett was second with eight first-place votes and 86 points, while John Lackey of the Los Angeles Angels got the other first-place vote and came in third. Cleveland's Fausto Carmona was fourth.

''I was excited. My family and everybody were around,'' Sabathia said on a conference call from his home in California. ''I was surprised. Beckett had a great year and an even better postseason.''

Sabathia went 19-7 with a 3.21 ERA and 209 strikeouts, pitching a major league-high 241 innings. Beckett (20-7) became the only big league pitcher to win 20 games since 2005, compiling a 3.27 ERA in 200 2-3 innings. Lackey led the AL in ERA at 3.01, going 19-9 and tossing 224 innings. Carmona was 19-8 with a 3.06 ERA.

Voting took place before the postseason, when Sabathia struggled while Beckett pitched the Red Sox to a World Series championship with a string of dominant outings.

''I did look at a few numbers,'' Sabathia said. ''I definitely thought that Beckett -- it could have went either way. I'm just happy and thankful that it went my way.''

The only other Cleveland pitcher to win the award was Hall of Famer Gaylord Perry in 1972. Now that he has one, Sabathia plans to display his trophy prominently at home.

''I'll probably keep it out. I'm sitting in my office right now, I'm looking for a spot. I'll probably put it right here,'' he said.

Sabathia is the first black pitcher to win a Cy Young Award since Dwight Gooden of the New York Mets in 1985 -- and the first in the AL since Oakland's Vida Blue in 1971.

''That's awesome to be mentioned with him,'' said Sabathia, adding that he attended a recent meeting designed to foster ideas for how to generate more interest in baseball among black kids.

While the top four Cy Young candidates had similar statistics, Sabathia's stamina apparently set him apart. After being sidelined by injuries the previous two seasons, the 6-foot-7, 290-pound left-hander stayed healthy all year and made 34 starts to Beckett's 30. That helped account for their wide gap in innings pitched.

The 27-year-old Sabathia also walked only 37 batters, giving him a remarkable strikeout-to-walk ratio that took pressure off his defense all season. Beckett had 194 strikeouts and 40 walks.

''I think just keeping down the walks,'' Sabathia said, ''being able to go deep in the games, I think was the biggest deal in helping me win this.''

Not totally unexpected, considering their season stats, although I would've expected the margin to be a lot closer.

[Red Sox Fan 734]

I think this is a bad choice. Sure Sabathia's stats were better but i would love to see Josh Beckett's stats if he pitched against KC and Chicago all year instead of New York and Toronto

[Arctic Blast]

Well, I'm a Cleveland fan, so I'm hardly unbiased. I also woulda been fine with Beckett winning it, though, and I AM surprised the margin of victory was what it was.

[Tannhauser]

I think this is a bad choice. Sure Sabathia's stats were better but i would love to see Josh Beckett's stats if he pitched against KC and Chicago all year instead of New York and Toronto

That's like arguing last year that Wang should've won it instead of Santana, aside from the fact that Wang only had 76 Ks (for 3.14 Ks/9 innings). And so what? The AL East had Baltimore and Tampa.

[ron100]

I also feel Beckett was hovved. But I often disagree with these choices. I remember when Nolan Ryan was pitching for California and won 22 games with the LA Angels who were last in offense and last in defense. The award went to Jim Palmer who won 3 more games while playing for a league champion. Now that was robbery! I can live with this one, but I believe that, once again the Indians had a littlle better offense behind Sabarhia, although Boston hadthe better defense.

[ron100]

I forhot to mention the year Ryan got robbrf he also set the all time single season strike out record and threw two no hitters.

[HoustonGM]

Not totally unexpected, considering their season stats, although I would've expected the margin to be a lot closer.

All it means is that perhaps voters are actually looking beyond "Wins".

I think this is a bad choice. Sure Sabathia's stats were better but i would love to see Josh Beckett's stats if he pitched against KC and Chicago all year instead of New York and Toronto

Sabathia's stats weren't better. They were nearly identical. Sabathia pitched more innings. That's why he was the correct choice.

I also feel Beckett was hovved. But I often disagree with these choices. I remember when Nolan Ryan was pitching for California and won 22 games with the LA Angels who were last in offense and last in defense. The award went to Jim Palmer who won 3 more games while playing for a league champion. Now that was robbery! I can live with this one, but I believe that, once again the Indians had a littlle better offense behind Sabarhia, although Boston hadthe better defense.

Nolan Ryan never won 22 games, and Palmer never won 25. Ryan placed 2nd to Palmer in 1973 when he went 21-16 and Palmer was 22-9 with a higher ERA and WHIP.

Also, the team's offense should have nothing to do with the award for best pitcher. It should go to the pitcher who provided his team with the best pitching performance.

Beckett and Sabathia both pitched equally well. Sabathia threw 40 more innings and went into the 7th 9 more times. Take two pitchers who pitched equally well. The one who pitched more often was the better pitcher in terms of value that season.

Wanna see something weird? They both had 1.141 WHIPs.

[CatKnight]

I'm a little surprised. Not undeserved by any means - Sabathia's a fine pitcher - but he completely disintegrated in the playoffs against the Yankees and Red Sox. I thought that would cost him.

I don't want to hear that Beckett faced tougher teams. The AL Central is a very tough division. I'll put Chicago/Detroit/Minnesota/Kansas City against Baltimore/New York/Toronto/Tampa any day you want, and the Central will win. Beckett did quite well - but not as many innings pitched. 'Nuf said.

[Wassit3]

I'm a little surprised. Not undeserved by any means - Sabathia's a fine pitcher - but he completely disintegrated in the playoffs against the Yankees and Red Sox. I thought that would cost him.

I don't want to hear that Beckett faced tougher teams. The AL Central is a very tough division. I'll put Chicago/Detroit/Minnesota/Kansas City against Baltimore/New York/Toronto/Tampa any day you want, and the Central will win. Beckett did quite well - but not as many innings pitched. 'Nuf said.

the voting takes place before the playoffs...

[Red Sox Fan 734]

I don't want to hear that Beckett faced tougher teams. The AL Central is a very tough division. I'll put Chicago/Detroit/Minnesota/Kansas City against Baltimore/New York/Toronto/Tampa any day you want, and the Central will win. Beckett did quite well - but not as many innings pitched. 'Nuf said.

Here is the AL east standings(minus Boston)
NY-94-68
Toronto-83-79
Baltimore-69-93
Tampa-66-99
There average win total is 78

Here is the Central standings:
Detroit 88-74
Minnesota-79-83
Chicago-72-90
KC-69-93
There average win total is 77

Know that isn't much of a difference but when you look at RS per game there is a larger difference
East
New York 6.0
Toronto 4.6
Baltimore 4.7
D-Rays 4.8
The average there is 5.025 runs a game

Central
Detroit 5.5
Minnesota 4.4
Chicago 4.3
KC- 4.4
The average there is 4.65 runs a game.... A difference of .375 runs a game which would bump u Becketts ERA by .375 runs a game which would make there stats this:

CC 19-7 3.21 ERA 241 IP 209 K's

Beckett 20-7 2.89 ERA 200 IP 194 K's

When you look at it like that except for the IP Beckett's stats are much better, CC has more K's but Beckett's K's per 9 innings is much higher

Also CC didnt face the yankees(best offense in the league) once this year.

[Coach Owens]

Here is the AL east standings(minus Boston)
NY-94-68
Toronto-83-79
Baltimore-69-93
Tampa-66-99
There average win total is 78

Here is the Central standings:
Detroit 88-74
Minnesota-79-83
Chicago-72-90
KC-69-93
There average win total is 77

Know that isn't much of a difference but when you look at RS per game there is a larger difference
East
New York 6.0
Toronto 4.6
Baltimore 4.7
D-Rays 4.8
The average there is 5.025 runs a game

Central
Detroit 5.5
Minnesota 4.4
Chicago 4.3
KC- 4.4
The average there is 4.65 runs a game.... A difference of .375 runs a game which would bump u Becketts ERA by .375 runs a game which would make there stats this:

CC 19-7 3.21 ERA 241 IP 209 K's

Beckett 20-7 2.89 ERA 200 IP 194 K's

When you look at it like that except for the IP Beckett's stats are much better, CC has more K's but Beckett's K's per 9 innings is much higher

Also CC didnt face the yankees(best offense in the league) once this year.

He faced the Mariners who had the second best offense, twice (I think).

[Coach Owens]

Also, Sabathia threw 4 complete games and a shutout, Beckett had 1 CG and no shutouts.

[HoustonGM]

CC 19-7 3.21 ERA 241 IP 209 K's

Beckett 20-7 2.89 ERA 200 IP 194 K's

When you look at it like that except for the IP Beckett's stats are much better, CC has more K's but Beckett's K's per 9 innings is much higher

Beckett's K per 9 innings is higher as it is.

The only thing your "adjusted" stat shows is a difference in ERA of about a third of a run. That's not "much" better. A 3.21 ERA over 240 innings is more valuable than a 2.89 ERA over 200 innings. Just like a 4.00 ERA over 200 innings is more valuable than a 3.70 ERA over 150 innings, and so on.

Also CC didnt face the yankees(best offense in the league) once this year.

No, he didn't face them at all.

Sabathia's ERA against his division was 3.26.
Beckett's ERA against his division was 3.38.

Sabathia's ERA against non-division teams was 3.16.
Beckett's ERA against non-division teams was 3.18.

They both did basically identical no matter who they were playing. They both faired extremely slightly worse against their division. If Sabathia was helped by his division, he would've put up better numbers against them then against non-division rivals.

They both pitched equally well. Sabathia threw more innings. Sabathia was more valuable because of that.

[CatKnight]

(Various snippages)
The average there is 5.025 runs a game (for the AL East)

The average there is 4.65 runs a game (AL Central).... A difference of .375 runs a game which would bump u Becketts ERA by .375 runs a game which would make there stats this:

CC 19-7 3.21 ERA 241 IP 209 K's

Beckett 20-7 2.89 ERA 200 IP 194 K's

Your argument is flawed.

We need to make a few assumptions here, but I can live with that.

The Red Sox faced Eastern opponents 54 times in 2007, Central opponents 35. We'll take it for granted the Indians did the exact opposite.

******

Josh Beckett had 30 starts in 2007. On average, that's 10 vs. the AL East, 6 against the AL Central.

In those games he averaged 6.68 innings pitched.

Assuming your numbers above are correct, then in an average game an AL East team scored 0.278 more runs in the 6.68 innings Beckett was there.

IF Beckett pitched in the AL Central, that's 4 games (10-6) where he would have given up .278 less runs. Out of 30.

Again, averaging everything out we can compute that 4 games out of 30 giving up .278 less runs means he would have given up .037 less runs over the course of the season. Remember the other 26 starts are unchanged.

Beckett's adjusted ERA is now 3.23.

*******

Sabathia had 34 starts. On average, that's 11 against the AL Central, 7 against the AL East.

He averaged 7.08 innings pitched per game. In 7.08 innings, an AL East team has time to score 0.295 more runs than AL Central according to your figures.

In all fairness, we're moving CC to the AL East. He now has to face the 'tougher' eastern teams 4 more times out of 34 starts.

4/34 * .295 = 0.0347. Again, CC's other 30 starts are unchanged.

Sabathia's adjusted ERA is now 3.24.

*******

I still don't buy that the AL East is a tougher division, excepting the Yankees. Even using your figures, it's simply not so much of a difference.

[BM_MAN]

From: http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/spor...ts&oref=slogin

Not totally unexpected, considering their season stats, although I would've expected the margin to be a lot closer.

Beckett was Screwed