Dear Roger: Eat Sh!t and Die

Excuse my French, but I'm getting sick and tired of hearing Red Sox fans say "I hate Roger Clemens, but if he put on a Red Sox uniform again, I'd root for him".

They seem to have forgotten the true meaning of "Red Sox Fan".

I don't care if the Red Sox finish third next year. As long as the Yankees finish fourth.

We root for Red Sox because they are the embodiment of all that is right and pure and good in this world. They fight evil at least 19 times each year. Sometimes as many as 26.

They lose more often than they should. But that's because good guys (almost always) finish last. That's the way life is. Dick Cheney is running the world and the Lord of Darkness himself has more than $200 million to spend on deflated roid-muppets.

But we stick with the Red Sox. The team itself is our childlike innocence -- the irrational idea that you keep pulling for the good guys, even when it looks hopeless.

Most of the idealistic baby boomer hippies are now wealthy Republicans, living in Darien watching the YES Network. But we are STILL Red Sox fans!

Roger Clemens can never be a part of that. He never was a part of that. Even at 15, I knew that Roger didn't belong in the same clubhouse with Rice, Buckner, Armas, Barrett and Gedman. Roger Clemens couldn't hold Dave Henderson's jockstrap.

In the afterlife -- which we all know looks like an Iowa cornfield -- Roger gets picked last. After Spike Owen. After Oil Can Boyd. Because no one wants to play with him.

If Roger comes back to the Red Sox, I will root for him to get shelled in every start. Two innings. Nine hits. Eight runs. Every game.

And then I will root for MY TEAM to find a way to come back. Like a three-game deficit in the ALCS, the Sox will chip away, one inning at a time. Roger gets 32 no-decisions. Guillermo Mota goes 32-0.

If Manny leaves and Roger comes back, I will spend all year rooting for Pedro and Manny, Mike Timlin and Mark Bellhorn, Derek Lowe and Bill Mueller -- regardless of what shirts they are wearing. I just feel bad for Big Papi.

I always felt that the real heavy in the Clemens departure was Duquette. He of the "twilight of his career" speech, the man who let Mo Vaughn walk, the same person who could convince Pedro to come but couldn't convince anyone to stay. Dan who was so tight fisted that Boston's top draft picks would not sign with the team. He was the continuation of what turned out to be 86 years of futility. Now our team has finally won it all but then again a lot of long time fans cannot or will not pay the exhorbitant fees demanded by the new ownership group. Were we better off before the ownership shift? Maybe, because we still had the rough edged not quite prime time team that we all loved to watch. Now we have a winner but the cost has been a pre-packaged, overpriced, overhyped, mega-mart version of baseball.

why do people hate Roger...even as a kid, i knew the reason why he went to Toronto was because of Managment... I think that Red Sox fans (or just clay :p ) think it was Rogers fault he left...it wasnt...I really do hope he doesnt re"sign" with the red sox...I hope he does go to the Yankees and win one more championship...I hate the Red Sox just as much as I hate the Yankees.....freaken Red Sox fans before 2004, felt like it was an eternty since they won there last championship...what about the patriots, celtics....to the bruins...and just one team didnt win during all this time....if i were a red sox fan, i would hate the team...and love the yankees...at least the yankees do what they need to do to win....winning the most championships in the MLB...

Being from Seattle, I hate Boston, there complaining...Seattle only has the 1979 champion sonics...(more recently WNBA STORM) but not counting that....Boston has 3 teams that have done very well...and Boston hasnt done that bad either...i hated being a Mariner Fan in the 80's and early 90's, I still rooted for them..but losing took a toll...ROger would be welcome on my Beloved Mariners...Simply the best active pitcher in Baseball.

Here's a response from a friend of mine:

In so many words, I agree with Clay. Clemens never struck me as the
kind of character that fit into my idealized Red Sox persona. Clemens
always seemed to be angry in the same way (if not as explosive) as Carl
Evertt. I don't think anyone would describe Carl Evertt as their
prototypical Red Sox. The Sox should be populated by odd ball
characters who can be annoying and temperamental but never caustic.
That this idealized team tends to fall short is part of our reality -
the bad guys do win most of the time. They have more money and are
driven by the shallow motivation that winning is everything. They place
performance before the person and while this does generate "winning"
teams, it's not what we publicly espouse to teach our sons and daughters
about the meaning of competition, sportsmanship and through these
mechanisms life. Hence, the underdog win is much more sweet. The
rarity of David beating Goliath is more satisfying than commonality of
Goliath beating David.

I never hated Roger. I'd love to see him come back and end it in Boston. The only times I wasn't fond of him were when he pitched against us in a Yankees uniform. That's just a natural reaction though. I hoped and prayed for him to strike out 29 every time he faced us with Toronto just to wipe the smug look off of Duquette's face. I'd want Roger back here under any circumstances.

Clay, do you care to weigh in on this topic? :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Clay Dreslough

Here's a response from a friend of mine:

In so many words, I agree with Clay. Clemens never struck me as the
kind of character that fit into my idealized Red Sox persona. Clemens
always seemed to be angry in the same way (if not as explosive) as Carl
Evertt. I don't think anyone would describe Carl Evertt as their
prototypical Red Sox. The Sox should be populated by odd ball
characters who can be annoying and temperamental but never caustic.
That this idealized team tends to fall short is part of our reality -
the bad guys do win most of the time. They have more money and are
driven by the shallow motivation that winning is everything. They place
performance before the person and while this does generate "winning"
teams, it's not what we publicly espouse to teach our sons and daughters
about the meaning of competition, sportsmanship and through these
mechanisms life. Hence, the underdog win is much more sweet. The
rarity of David beating Goliath is more satisfying than commonality of
Goliath beating David.

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and this is coming from a Boston fan whos teams have won how many championships in the last 50 years (Celtics, Bruins, Patriots and Sox)?

it doesnt make any sense....I think Boston fans are brainwashed to think they are the underdogs yet in many other sports they have dominated...They are just like New York......Go to a place where championships are rare...Dare you to move to Seattle, Where we havent won a championship in any sport (4main ones MLB, NFL, NBA, or NHL) in 25 years.....then you can say you like being the underdog...where you have Excellent teams but never outstanding teams that make it all the way....Sure the Seahawks are good this year, they were just as good in 1984..and there (then) star running back went down with an injury in the preseason and still won 12 games....The Sonics were Excellent and the best they got was in 1996 when they Shawn Kemp and Gary Payton led them against the bulls....or the Seattle Mariners of this Generation from 2000-2003 for 4 years the Mariners were the best team in the regular season. yet, We didnt win a championship....

I am just tired of the Boston Red Sox...they are overhyped and I hope they lose every game next year....and yes, I hate the Yankees too...probably even more.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boomboom

Being from Seattle, I hate Boston, there complaining

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I'm not complaining. I LOVE being a Boston sports fan. The Pats of the 80s and 90s were GREAT FUN, even though they never won a Super Bowl. They still had some exciting games. And the Sox of the 70s, 80s and 90s were also a blast to watch -- without winning it all.

When I watched the 2003 ALCS, I figured it was the best 7-game series in the history of sport. Even though we lost. I recognize drama when I see it. Of course, the 2003 ALCS now ranks 2nd on my list...

:)

As for Roger, I hated him even when he was with the Red Sox. It's only after he left that he really started to show his abrasive personality to the whole world.

Clay

Nice one on the "priceless" play Clay.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SFSteveG

Nice one on the "priceless" play Clay.

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I feel like I shouldn't get political on these boards. I wouldn't want someone to think that I'm going to ignore their bug reports just cuz they have a George Bush (or Curt Schilling) photo in their sig.

I voted for GWB in 2000, and consider myself a moderate with libertarian tendencies. But this is probably the worst presidency in the last 100 years.

Clay

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Clay Dreslough

I feel like I shouldn't get political on these boards. I wouldn't want someone to think that I'm going to ignore their bug reports just cuz they have a George Bush (or Curt Schilling) photo in their sig.

I voted for GWB in 2000, and consider myself a moderate with libertarian tendencies. But this is probably the worst presidency in the last 100 years.

Clay

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I was going to try and argur the 100 years thing but all the guys who came to mind as being really sh!tty are 1800's

I'm not so sure that the alternatives would have been any more palatable. Especially Kerry. It scares me to think that he came very close to being the leader of the free world.

I consider myself a right leaning moderate. I actually wrote in Ralph Nader last time. It took some convincing of myself (It was either Bush or write in Nader) but I couldn't vote Bush. I did however vote mostly Republican on the rest of the ballot. I went Nader purely because he seems to be pretty honest. I thought that would be a nice change if 51% of the other voters lost their minds too and voted for him. :D

I'd rather just see a super rich guy win it. Ross Perot would have been great. It just would have shown that something new, no matter what it was, wouldn't be that bad.

You RedSux fans are a funny bunch.

You whine for a Hundred years(actually 86) about how you can't win a World Series because of the :Evil" Yankees. Then you actually GET LUCKY and win one andr you still ain''t happy.

Well alls I can say is have fun watching Damon win wwith the Yankees while the RedSux finish last.


GO YANKEES!!!.

Too bad that you Spankee fans will be watching Damon warm a bench in the not too distant future. He was pretty hurt this past season, and repeatedly. He didn't take one for the team, he took one for his next contract. By the way, nice job so far on improving that geriatric bunch of declining skills, used up, broken down, aging fast, starting pitchers. Most of them spend the winter in Florida looking at the Marlins World Series trophy while they're wearing plaid pants pulled up to their chests and sandals with black socks. I hear that Randy Johnson took up shuffleboard in the offseason to keep in shape. Randy's got a 3 digit social security card, At first glance it's hard to tell if you're at the Egyptian mummy exhibit or in the Yankee's clubhouse, I read that the Yankee's are getting AARP magazine delivered to the locker room to assist the players in their declining years................

I think Roger to the Sox is pointless. I think he's retiring. If not, he should. Anyone who watched that performance in the World Series can see that. That being said, he's one of the great pitchers of the generation, and along with Maddux, one of two sure-fire hall of fame starters presently playing. And I agree that the only reason he left the Sox was Duquette.

Damon leaving hurts. We don't have a reasonable CF to replace him, or a leadoff hitter. I don't know what Jacoby Ellsbury's progress is, but he won't be ready for a couple years at least, I expect.

As for Bush being the worst president in the last 100 years...anybody remember Richard Nixon? Or Jimmy Carter and the hostages in Iran? Or Herbert Hoover, who's economic policy partially caused and failed to relieve the Depression? Or Warren Harding and the Teapot Dome? I think all of these qualified as worse than a difficult, possibly questionable war.

Roger can still pitch, if you want to talk about just post-season, that is just a small sample, for the whole freaken season he was a stud...sure he might not be as good next year as he was last year, but i dont think we will see a pitcher pitch as good as roger did this year....now if he just had some run support he could have won 23-25 games..

I think Roger will retire. I mean what does he have left to prove?

He could come back to Boston and finally top Cy Young in the wins category for the Red Sox. They're both tied at 192 on the Sox's all time list. I'd think that the combination of that and the new ownership may be enough to get Roger back where he belongs. At least for one season.

I don't know what Clemens is going to do, other than that if he doesn't retire, he's going to want to pitch for a contending team.

Also, someone is going to pay him 7 figures if he wants to pitch. Like I said, I don't know about him, but if it was me, I wouldn't retire.

Who Cares Jack Morris was like Clemens but aye you can only be loyal to yourself.

I rooted for the Tigers until they let go of Travis Fryman. Dont know if they have any care for the long term, its just the here and now.

At least in baseball mogul i can hold on to my top 2 starters, 2 relievers and 4 hitters for the entire career and build a decent team around them and hope my fans rouse to the realization I care to keep the team strong and the greats in the city.

But Roger like Jack are travelers for what it means for a better career elsewhere.

Roger to the Sox is a stupid idea. We already have like 7 starters, unless we get rid of Clement, Arroyo or Wells before the season starts to fill our holes elsewhere. If it made sense to the team, I would say who gives a **** about how he left, that was almost 10 years ago and the only person around then was Tim Wakefield (and Trot late in the year). The ownership, front office, everything has changed.

My prediction is pretty much what others have been saying. I think he plays in the WBC and either a) retires forever or b) signs with the Astros after May 1st.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boedladam

Roger to the Sox is a stupid idea. We already have like 7 starters, unless we get rid of Clement, Arroyo or Wells before the season starts to fill our holes elsewhere. If it made sense to the team, I would say who gives a **** about how he left, that was almost 10 years ago and the only person around then was Tim Wakefield (and Trot late in the year). The ownership, front office, everything has changed.

My prediction is pretty much what others have been saying. I think he plays in the WBC and either a) retires forever or b) signs with the Astros after May 1st.

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Wells wants to be traded west or he's threatened to retire. Arroyo is the pitcher that the other teams seem to like in trade talks (other than the prospects). I think that both of them may be traded to fill center and Short. Clemens was on the sidelines during the Rose Bowl with the Rangers owner. i'm guessing that he may play in Dallas this season. I'd still love for him to come back to Boston though.