Wow...I'm so friggin' pumped....they are apparently very close to signing Burnett and Giles....this team could be a serious contender next year....can't WAIT!!!!
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Wow...I'm so friggin' pumped....they are apparently very close to signing Burnett and Giles....this team could be a serious contender next year....can't WAIT!!!!
The Jays have been run horribly since Riccardi took over, and this move isn't that great either. You know your team sucks when guys like Worrell and Kline rather setup than close for you. Riccardi hasn't made a single smart baseball move in free agency, and the only decent trade he did was getting rid of Billy Koch.Quote:
Originally Posted by mooseman74
Three former Jays SS played in this year's allstar game, and only Young was traded before Riccardi's time. We wouldn't have had the need to get Aaron Hill had we kept either Isturiz or Lopez instead of keeping crappy Woodward.
And that pitching staff is a mess. Miguel Batista 3 years ago! Ugh! Kerry Lightenberg? Terry Adams? They had a need for a closer and didn't even bother with Armando Benetiz that year! Cliff Polite became dominant once he left the Jays, but he was a horrible pick too. And let's not to mention the good starters he just gave up. Carpenter (Riccardi woudln't sign him to a guarantee major league contract) and Escobar. The trio of Halladay, Carpenter and Escobar would've been a light version of the Oakland trio, but instead, we ended up with the likes of Towers and Chacin. Wow.
And the worst move, absolute worst move ever. Getting rid of Delgado! They didn't bother to sign the big bat, and complained all last year that they lacked the big bat. Well duh! And now they can't afford Konerko, so who they gonna get? Overbay? Palease. WTF was Kosike signed too, that was such a dumb move. And now they want Giles?! A guy who's lost his power and isn't nearly the player he was 4 or 5 years ago. My God this team is run horribly.
We have a glut of infielders as well as LF (Catalanato, Gross, Griffen), and Riccardi hasn't been able to make one move for a big bat? And remeber how he kept on saying xxx was the catcher of the future, yet none has panned out! Phelps and Cash have been garbage, and Quieroz isn't that hot either. And they couldn't even get a decent player for Phelps!
And you know how the Jays keep on bragging about their minor league system? Well, Baseball America has said that the system is only average, without a single dominant player. Sure, they have solid role players lined up in the minors, but we need a game breaker! Dustin McGowan, Dave Bush, Gustavo Chacin, Gabe Gross, John Ford Griffen, Guiermo Quieroz, Jason Arnold, Aaron Hill etc. I don't see a single potential game breaker! Most of these guys will turn out fine, but no one's gonna take them in say a Barry Zito.
The reason why Oakland is so good is that they have similar roster buildup like the Jays, but they know how to draft pitchers! Harden, Blanton are the next wave, and freaking Huston Street, the Jays coudln't even come up with a player like that despite taking all these college players.
I may be ranting a lot, but we're talking about a team that used to produce studs like Hengten, Guzman, ward, had to trade away Jeff Kent, and more recently, Delgado, Wells, Green, and the aforementioned pitchers. Under the Riccardi regime, all I see is this .500 team that keeps promising to get better next year.
By the way... Burnent is coming to the M's ;)
Well...now that Giles signed with SD we have more money to put towards getting Burnett. :D
Burnett will not sign. Comparable contracts from any other city is far more attractive. Players don't like the lack of fannfare and baseball knowledge in Canada.Quote:
Originally Posted by mooseman74
The way I see it, Burnett will come to Toronto only if Riccardi gives him a 5 year 65 mil deal. But that'd be gross overpay.
I read in the Star or the Sun (can't remember) that the Jays could go as high as 14 mill/season on Burnett......that would likely mean 5 years/ 70 million......hopefully JP makes some decent trades at the meetings too.
The Blue Jays have always been my favourite team and every year I am temporarilly hypnotized by the Blue Jays Personel. This past season lasted a little bit longer when the Jays had there hot start but thats all its ever gonna e is hot starts until they extremely improve their farm system. I went to a Syracuse Skychiefs game last season and that team is filled with strong prospects that if they can actually make it to the Blue Jays before being traded for some no-name pitcher who turns out to be nothing then the Jays may just have a decent team in the next 2-4 years. But the baseball fans in canada are getting bored of the same old thing every year. Oh how i wish to go back to '92. I love you Joe Carter
It's OFFICIAL!!! Burnett to the Jays for 5 years/55 million. These two signings are really creating a big buzz in Toronto and this could be very good for attendance...if nothing else. I think Burnett will do fine in T.O as the #2 guy and coming in knowing he's the #2. If Halladay stays healthy he's one of the/if not the best pitcher in baseball.....and if Towers and Chacin repeat last seasons performance....and IF Lilly (assuming he's still here) can return to his 2004 form then we could have a great rotation. Not to mention much more confidence in turning over the ball in the 9th to BJ.
A lot of 'ifs'...but it could finally be their year to get back to the post-season!
Now JP has to get working on that offence.
I am surprised by this signing, since Burnett had more interest to go to the Cards or Orioles. It is sad that the Jays can only get players after they are pretty much turned down by their first two choices. Anyways, this is indeed a pretty good signing. Nevertheless, I'd rather wanted the Jays to try and nab Zito instead. I mean, since Riccardi is keen to do business with the A's, he should've just tried to get Zito. I'm not sure what the Jays have that the A's would've really wanted. But, witht he abundance of young pitching available, as well as excessive LF players, they should try that. I foursome of Halladay, Zito, Burnett and Lily would've been awsome.Quote:
Originally Posted by mooseman74
Now that they've settled the problem of Pitching, I want to see them get rid of Batista, Hinske and Koskie. Koskie can go back to the Twins, esp. since they are actively looking for a 3B. I don't know if anyone would want Hinske though. Regardless, they really need to get rid of the extra 3B, LF and Batista. I wonder what player would be available though. Maybe KC, with their lack of depth would be willing to deal Sweeney for these extra bats and pitching. There was a rumor today that the Jays were gonna trade Wells for Abreu. That would've been good, though the asking price was way too high. Apparently, the Reds also have excessive OF, and are willing to deal Dunn. That'd be something.
The team is solid now, but I still don't see the same talent as the Angels, Marlins or ChiSox. The team still needs a bit of juice.
I'm not a really big fan of the Blue Jays, but if Halladay can stay healthy I think they just might be the team to beat this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by B. Gizzle
11 million dollars for Burnett? :eek: I'd be happy if my team got him for an incentive deal maybe in the 7 million range but 11? If anything goes wrong with this guy Toronto is in trouble. Toronto probably cannot eat a contract that large if he's hurt. It looks from the outside like an attempt to put butts in seats. I hope it works out for the Jays but I doubt that it'll turn out well.
agreed. If it works out, the Jays are fine, if these two signings don't work, this team will be on its last legs in Canada.Quote:
Originally Posted by robinhoodnik
Well...I feel a lot better about this trade than I would if the Jays had been the ones signing Loaiza to 3 years/21 million....that's just insanity....that automatically drove up the starters salaries.
How the heck can you blame riccardi for not signing Delgado? The Jays couldnt afford him. I fail to see how that is Riccardi's fault and maked him a bad gm. And we cant draft pitchers? How about Halladay? How about Carpenter? Wells and Green were both traded by Gord Ash not Riccardi so again you cant put blame on him. And the same goes for Kent. I think my favourite is you mentioned a "game breaker"...Chacin had an excellent rookie year and so did Hill...both of which you denounced at "game breakers". Pretty sure a 13-9 record and a 3.72 ERA is worth another look. And a .274 average with 40 RBI is darn good for a guy who appeared in just 100 games and played for a team not recognized for being offensively gifted. These two players played much better than some guys this year who are normally considered "game breakers" such as Mike Mussina (13-8 4.41 ERA) and Tony Womack (.249 average). and further...Barry Zito has very similar career numbers as Roy Halladay and Burnett (minus the wins/losses) however Zito has not thrown a no hitter.Quote:
Originally Posted by B. Gizzle
for one thing, right after Delgado signed, it was announced that the team was given the extra cash. Hmm... The reason why this is brought up is because Riccardi knew that the team needs the bat, but couldn't or wouldn't convice Ted Rogers to sign him. That's pretty bad as far as a GM goes.Quote:
Originally Posted by QHowes
And his other blunders over the past few seasons, which I've mentioned already include getting rid of 2 all star SS, giving away good pitching and not signing Benetiz when he was cheap.
For one thing, every single top tier player the Jays drafted were under the watch of Gord Ash, so I don't know what you are trying to get at. Riccardi is horrible at drafting pitchers because he simply hasn't been able to bring in any one like a new Halladay or Carpenter. Look at the A's, the lose Mulder and Hudson, and they DRAFT in Blanton, Harden and Street. That's quality, not what the Jays are doing. On the subject of Green etc. I don't think you read my post completely, because I did not blame Riccardi for those, I merely stated the quality of player back then to the ones now. Back in the Ash days, the high picks were all star quality players, Delgado, Wells, Green, Lopez, Halladay, Escobar, Carpenter. Now, the players are basically good, but scouts don't see any of them being franchise players. The main problem with this is that no team will take these prospects for franchise players, and they can't help in trading away bad salaries like Hinske. If he had like a Lastings Meledge, then it is possible he could've put together Hinske, Meledge and some pitching prospects and make a run at Manny.Quote:
Originally Posted by QHowes
Of course, Ash was an idiot for not signing Pedro as a teen and trading Wells for Sirotka, but at least he did things and took risks, Riccardi hasn't done anything to get that top guy in drafts.
In fact, in the last 5 years of Ash's reign, he complied a much better record then Riccardi will. For Riccardi to match Ash's record, he needs to win 107 games this year!
Funny how you bring up two players who are on the decline, and Womack was never a game breaker. If you'd said oh, I don't know, A Rod of Pujols then that'd be another case. In any event, I've already stated that the Jays are drafting solid players, but the problem is that these players don't have high upsides, so they are not really trade bait for stars, and are not projected as stars either. There isn't anything wrong with being solid, but they are not the type of players who will put fear into the heart of opposing players. Midrotational starter and decent middle infielders are OK, but like I said, if Riccardi didn't get rid of our actual game breaking players, then that would've been much better. The Jays lineup is mediocre, without any punch. Even with the addition of Overbay, which I do like a lot, they are still missing sparkplugs for small ball or juicy bats for bashing. If they were able to trade for Tejada, or Ramirez, then it'd be another story.Quote:
Originally Posted by QHowes
I didn't say Halladay was bad, so I don't know what you are attempting to say by putting him here. But let's compare the other two pitchers.Quote:
Originally Posted by QHowes
Barry Zito: 86W 53L 3.5 ERA 945K 1 Cy Young in 6 years
AJ Burnett 49W 50L 3.73 ERA 753K in 7 years. With the one year writeoff, let's just say he also pitched 6 years. Look at those numbers, they are not even close. Zito has more Ks, far more wins, and a Cy Young. And Burnett, a no hitter where he walked 9 batters? Please. That is more fluky than consistency over a season. The real kicker here though is that Burnett has had arm trouble, so this deal can blow up real bad, while Zito has been healty in the past, and while that is no prediction to the future, I'd say that if I were giving away 11 million, I'd give it to the guy who wasn't injured. And what I was saying about Riccardi anyways, was that he should make a run at Zito despite signing Burnett, cause that'd really make this team a contender for years to come.