One of my classes might take a trip to watch the rally the week after next. That'd be pretty damn cool.
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One of my classes might take a trip to watch the rally the week after next. That'd be pretty damn cool.
Because GEORGE SOROS, that's why!Quote:
Originally Posted by etothep
very fair and true...except for the fact many republicans critique Bush for not vetoing more (petey did in here)....which is pretty much the same they blame Clinton for (though admittedly they don't blame Congress during his administration as much). I don't see any Dems criticising Clinton for anything whatsoever. Of course, republicans give Clinton more blame and Dems give Bush more blame...it all depends upon what team you're on.Quote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
also..I believe Dems have had much more of a majority during Bush's 2nd term and Obamas 1st than Republicans had during any of Clintons time. not really a significant point, but one worthy of mentioning in this discussion.
God who let their ****ing great-grandfather use the computer!!
Reagan, Red Dawn, Rocky IV, Apple Pie, Shotguns, Coors, Mickey Mantle, Yankee Stadium, Ted Nugent, Hummers, big dicks, AMERICA
Fυck you guys, I'm about to make a fortune b/c of these protests
I'm going up there & selling bootstraps
$$$$
lol
How the hell did you get **** through the filter?Quote:
Originally Posted by etothep
etothep has permission to say crazy **** yoQuote:
Originally Posted by Kobie
That's impressively obtuse, even by internet standards. By that "logic", no President ever bears any responsibility for things they sign into law.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete4256
Absolutely agree that he should have vetoed the bailouts, though in my case it's not a matter of "now"--I was always opposed.Quote:
Either one ... are you now agreeing with the Tea Party and ME ... that Bush should not have signed either one of these??
Well, this is Pete we're talking about here.Quote:
Originally Posted by dps
When Obama signs something into law, it's the socialist communist kenyan dictator taking away our freedoms! When Bush signed something into law, the Democrats made him do it.
This. They seem incredibly unorganized.Quote:
Originally Posted by haveacigar
Regardless how you view their motives/wants, if they can't get things more clearly organized, it's going to be difficult to give them any support/attention.
As for a 20 dollar minimum wage, lol. I always hear about how necessary it is to raise minimum wage, but for some reason, it just seems to escape those that want this what it would do to the economy as a whole. You think companies are just going to take the hit on payroll on their bottom lines and not pass those expenses on to their customers?
If we had to pay all of our employees 20 dollars an hour at Velosity (my electronics store) we would have to fire at least 2 of our 8 full timers, probably 3, and we would have to dramatically raise our hour bench rate in order to keep up with payroll.
Every dollar that we spend on individual payroll, we spend another 50 cents on taxes, not to mention the large amount of overheard. Labor is already massively expensive, which is a large reason why so many companies are focusing on finding the most efficient way possible to run their businesses, and get away from unnecessary labor costs.
Why don't they (whoever is wanting such a high minimum wage, not necessarily this group since it might not have been their demands) just come out and say they want everyone to have free money, and no one to make too much money in this country? It's rather utopian-like society with the ideals. But would never work in a free working economy. All it would do would create a larger shift from the rich to the poor.
Because it's not about one set of ideals or wants or demands or whatever. It's about restoring power to the people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
They're not having trouble gaining support or attention. As I said earlier in the thread, the overall message of ending the influence of money, the wealthiest 1% and corporations on politics and speaking out against political corruption is one that people of all different ideologies can agree on, even if they completely disagree on other major issues.
Get big business and money out of politics and let the direction of the country be decided by the people. That is what the Occupy movement, as a whole, wants.
Occupy Wall Street has officially been pigeon holed by the mainstream media.
So? Almost everybody agrees, for example, that health care has become too expensive, but there's no consensus at all about what to do about it. If all the protesters are doing is attempting to draw attention to the problem, they're preaching to the choir. If they are actually putting forth certain suggestions about what to do about it, then they've done a very poor job of communicating those suggestions, and to the extent that anyone connected with or claiming to speak for the movement has put forth any suggestions, a lot of us don't agree with those suggestions.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
It may be broad, but, again, the "solution" put forth is to restore decision-making to the people and take it away from the corporations and their puppet politicians. Once that (unfortunately, probably impossible) hurdle is passed, then focus on the individual issues. Healthcare costs a problem? The overall message of Occupy says: Let democracy decide what the solution to it is, not the insurance companies.Quote:
Originally Posted by dps
Maybe the main goal is to draw attention to the issue, but I don't think that's at all "preaching to the choir." Most people just don't give a crap, and this movement says to those in charge that, hey, a lot of us do give a crap and are sick of our country being controlled by a handful of multi-billionaires and maybe it will open the eyes of many of the apathetic masses.
Attachment 35575Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Exactly. This is a good thing. There are alot of people (conservatives) who don't have a problem with our politicians being puppets. Just ask the conservative supreme court. Just like there are alot of people(conservatives) who feel our healthcare system is fine as is and doesn't need to be overhauled. Just ask Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson & his supporters who campaigned on the premise that our healtchare was the best in the world and didn't have to be changed.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Our healthcare is fine. It's our system of paying for it that's screwed up.Quote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
unrelated, but love the signature quote michelleQuote:
Isn't it ironic that the Red Sox spent $161 million building a team around the concept of sabermetrics, yet G.M. Theo Epstein and manager Terry Francona blame Boston's epic collapse not on statistics but on the lack of gold old team chemistry? Where is the algorithm for that?
“There’s a lot of stuff we wouldn’t have to clean up if the city provided basic human rights, like a Port-A-Potty,” said demonstrator Gene Wagner. “If you would’ve given us a Port-A-Potty 30 days ago, we would’ve maintained it ourselves.”
Yeh, I'm sure Gene Wagner would have jumped at the chance to clean a port a potty being used by hundreds (thousands?) of people (with a good chunk of them being hippies)
"Life, Liberty, The Pursuit of Happiness, and port-o-potties,"-Basic Human Rights
Just don't eat fiber and consume a lot of cheese if you plan on protesting noob.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
First off this has been a matter close to my heart for a very long time. All of us have had this discussion many times on this forum. As for the sentiment that this is a hippie unorganized movement: let me say this. Most movements have a figurehead, like the Obama campaign or Christians with Jesus. The fact that this movement does not is the very reason it has spread not only all over America but to other countries. They don't need a clear message on one topic and they learned this from the Tea Party.
Jeff, If all lower class people were getting paid $20 per hour how many more people would buy your services? I would bet you would have to hire more people at $20 per hour. You seem to like the trickle down concept but it has failed horribly. If the bulk of the US population had more money to spend it would be a tidal wave.
This is my vision of a fair United States. Tarrif the hell out of China imports and any country that uses slave labor, has poor woman rights, subjects its peoples, doesn't have environmental laws. Give massive tax cuts to companies who deal only with "Good" countries. Tax the hell out of companies that don't. Cut the military in half or more in peace time. Universal health care. Universal Education. Massive pay raises so the average family can have one parent at home with the children if they choose to do so. Stop arming the world. You may think I sound like a Christian here but as you know I'm not.
I love the irony in all this. Liberals constantly slammed the tea party movement at its inception, called it unorganized chaos, criticized them as fools and mocked them. Now their own unorganized movement comes up and they stand an applaud. Republicans stood and applauded the patriotism of those "taking america back" at tea party conventions across the country. Now they laugh and mock a liberal movement as unorganized chaos by uneducated fools looking to cause trouble.Quote:
Originally Posted by guidi2009
I stand and applaud them both. Power to the people!! As the republicans political machine stuck its claws in and has attempted to pervert the tea party movement, we already see the seeds of the democrat political machine doing the same to occupy. I hope they all stand strong and fight back against the machine.
You never found me saying such things. Yes I disagree with their message and I know for a fact that it was started by powerful Republicans but I predicted their movement well before it happened because after the horrible failure of Bush they had to reinvent the party. It took on a life of it's own after Dick Army left it and I respect that.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
i'm not saying you in particular....Quote:
Originally Posted by guidi2009
the movement didn't happen because the GOP needed to reinvent themselves, just as the occupy movement isn't being created by the democratic party. These are genuine grassroots movements which are being perverted by the political machines from both parties as they try to take that movement as their own and corrupt it to fit their ideology. It's their way of maintaining control and power. Keep your enemies closer. The tea party movement was and remains a threat to republicans as it contends to expose so called conservatives that don't live up to their promises. The more republican politicians can infiltrate the movement and call it their own, the more control they have over their voice. Same thing with occupy. It's how the two parties have squashed / contained these types of movements by the people.
Any female minorities want to help out and get involved in Houston (TX, not GM)? They need you:
OccupyHouston:
Quote:
Announcement from diversity: need more non-white non-males involved!!!!!
Went down to Occupy Fort Collins today to get some interviews and film the protest for a news story. From speaking to these people, it seems they know they have a real issue but they don't quite know how to deal with it. This guy talked to me for 10 minutes about how they want to make the campaign and political separation of corporations and politics a constitutional amendment. That's, frankly, the long difficult way of doing things.
It just seems as though these people know they are talking about something important...but they don't quite know the process of change. Jon Stewart said it best though when he said "Maybe if the people in power had made solutions, we wouldn't have people who have no idea how to solve anything yelling in the streets."
We're too nice in Minnesota. I think we need some unruly protestors from New York to show us how it's done... maybe that guy that **** on the police car.
Quote:
"I feel so bad ... why don't they want to arrest us?" said Sunday Alabi, 61.
A Tea Partier, a Union Leader and a CEO are sitting at a table with a plate of 12 cookies. The CEO picks up 11 cookies, turns to the Tea Partier and says, "You'd better watch that Union guy, he's trying to take your cookie."
http://www.king5.com/home/Thousands-...131923893.html
Video about :22 - :27
I see this movement as the equivalent of me putting a political sign in my yard.Quote:
Originally Posted by haveacigar
If I put a "Ron Paul for President" sign in my yard, I'm not trying to advance any specific points, or even convince anyone to vote for Ron Paul. If I were trying to do this, the sign would say something like "Vote For Ron Paul Because He Wants To End The War In Iraq".
The point of the yard sign is to let other like-minded people know that they are not alone. With all the handouts to Wall Street by both the left and the right, people that are against these policies start to feel like they are in a shrinking minority. Non-violent civil disobedience by a few thousand people can bring attention to issues and help remind the millions in the silent majority that they are not alone in thinking that the country has been co-opted by the top 1%.
Public demonstrations precede policy -- not the other way around. The Montgomery Bus Boycotts started in 1955. But it wasn't until 1964 that the Civil Rights Act was passed. Rosa Parks didn't have a 16,119-word bill in mind when she chose to sit in the front of the bus. But that's what resulted after 9 years of many different groups bringing attention to these issues.
And now ... I go out on a limb. I think the Tea Party and the Occupy Movement have the same goal, even though they don't realize it yet. They are both disgusted by the system we've had for the last 30 years whereby politicians and lobbyists shift wealth from middle class to the upper class. The Tea Party blames big government and Occupy Wall Street blames big business. But they are both right. Heck, Wall Street doesn't even need to hire lobbyists because the Whitehouse keeps hiring Wall Street CEOs as the country's leading economic advisers.
When the government writes a $1 Trillion check to Wall Street, both "big government" and "big business" are to blame. The same is true for the billions handed out to Halliburton or Fannie Mae or The University Of Phoenix. It would be nice if both movements realized they are on the same side in trying to stop this type of corruption.
Nicely done Clay.
One tidbit I heard today was someone complaining that taxes on millionaires in the latest Obama jobs plan 'starts class warfare'. I thought that was hilarious - STARTS?!? The middle class has been losing class warfare for decades.
Thats like the Germans standing at Normandy telling the allied troops that they better not think about landing or else they might start world war 2.
It's only class warfare when the shots are fired upwards.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alloutwar
huh? i thought reading through these forums that the tea party was a bunch of idiotic hillbillies and occupy was a bunch of sophisticated patriots? how can they both be right? well...i suppose they could still have the same goal though despite that. :cool:Quote:
And now ... I go out on a limb. I think the Tea Party and the Occupy Movement have the same goal, even though they don't realize it yet. They are both disgusted by the system we've had for the last 30 years whereby politicians and lobbyists shift wealth from middle class to the upper class. The Tea Party blames big government and Occupy Wall Street blames big business. But they are both right. Heck, Wall Street doesn't even need to hire lobbyists because the Whitehouse keeps hiring Wall Street CEOs as the country's leading economic advisers.
When the government writes a $1 Trillion check to Wall Street, both "big government" and "big business" are to blame. The same is true for the billions handed out to Halliburton or Fannie Mae or The University Of Phoenix. It would be nice if both movements realized they are on the same side in trying to stop this type of corruption.
Huh. You must be reading different forums than I am.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
Kobie and dickay. Hug right now
do not wantQuote:
Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989