Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
Another horribly written
article on the Yanks-Sox rivalry. This sucky writer, ironically with the name Connor (+1 OD sucks) tries to persuade me it is a better rivalry than any other because of the history, even though all the demons have been hammered out (Red Sox ending title drought, A-Rod with a ring). At this point I would rather watch Giants, Dodgers, or Cubs, Cardinals than the Yanks, YAWN, Red Sox.
For my money Jets-Pats or Steelers-Ravens probably the best rivalry in sports and has been that way for years.
+1,000,000. I'm sooo tired of Yankees-Red Sux blah blah blah, best rivalry evah! blah, blah, blah. Stop force feeding us with what you deem to be the best rivalry ever. This is the crowning drawback of the unbalanced schedule. I'm so bored with the Yankees, Sox, Rays and O's. The Tigers were probably our greatest rival in the old AL East days, and we get them 7-10 games a year, but we've gotta have the four teams in our division 19 times or whatever the hell it is. Forget about how unfair it is for the teams in the AL East that don't play in Boston and New York. It is f***ing profoundly, maddeningly, mind-numbingly dull.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
actionjackson
+1,000,000. I'm sooo tired of Yankees-Red Sux blah blah blah, best rivalry evah! blah, blah, blah. Stop force feeding us with what you deem to be the best rivalry ever. This is the crowning drawback of the unbalanced schedule. I'm so bored with the Yankees, Sox, Rays and O's. The Tigers were probably our greatest rival in the old AL East days, and we get them 7-10 games a year, but we've gotta have the four teams in our division 19 times or whatever the hell it is. Forget about how unfair it is for the teams in the AL East that don't play in Boston and New York. It is f***ing profoundly, maddeningly, mind-numbingly dull.
Well, the media is going to try to force-feed us whatever game they're showing. If it's an interleague game between the Pirates and the Tigers, and both teams are 20 games below .500, whatever outlet is stuck with broadcasting it is still going to be pushing some angle as to why this is not just an important game, but a historical match-up.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
with all thats happened between the Sox and Yanks, I don't see how one can argue that they are baseballs best rivalry. Sure, you may be sick of them as they get more air time...but if you're being honest with yourself thats the only legitimate answer. To say otherwise sounds like sour grapes.
btw, i too hate the unbalanced scheduling.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dickay
To say otherwise sounds like sour grapes.
Says the Red Sox fan.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kobie
Says the Red Sox fan.
says the non-sox/yankee fan
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dickay
with all thats happened between the Sox and Yanks, I don't see how one can argue that they are baseballs best rivalry. Sure, you may be sick of them as they get more air time...but if you're being honest with yourself thats the only legitimate answer. To say otherwise sounds like sour grapes.
btw, i too hate the unbalanced scheduling.
There has to be a compelling, current storyline to make a rivalry a must watch. I don't see how the Yankees and Sox have one anymore. Going off of history though important just isn't enough. Two other factors need to work. There needs to be some controversy which there is none, and also something has to be at stake, which at this point of the year it's too early for that.
That is why I point to the Cardinals and Cubs, though it might be rumors, I think Pujols becoming a free agent is controversial enough and he is at stake. Dodgers, Giants is the other one I mention though it seems more like the Dodgers battling themselves more than anything and you also have the fan incident as well.
I would absolutely tune in to watch any BOS NYY series all the time back in the day when there was something truly on the line. Nowadays it just doesn't have the same impact as it once did.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
There has to be a compelling, current storyline to make a rivalry a must watch. I don't see how the Yankees and Sox have one anymore. Going off of history though important just isn't enough. Two other factors need to work. There needs to be some controversy which there is none, and also something has to be at stake, which at this point of the year it's too early for that.
That is why I point to the Cardinals and Cubs, though it might be rumors, I think Pujols becoming a free agent is controversial enough and he is at stake. Dodgers, Giants is the other one I mention though it seems more like the Dodgers battling themselves more than anything and you also have the fan incident as well.
I would absolutely tune in to watch any BOS NYY series all the time back in the day when there was something truly on the line. Nowadays it just doesn't have the same impact as it once did.
i don't quite understand this logic. By this logic, there can be no great historic rivalries as they are always "in the moment". One of if not the highest drawing NBA game this year was Lebron returning to CLE early season. Does that mean that MIA / CLE is the NBA's best rivalry?
Storylines are one thing, I agree with you they draw attention and are great. But rivalries are something built up over time. They need a history. They may not be the most compelling game at the time, but they bring a ton of history which creates drama.
I'm not a Duke or NC fan, but to me thats college hoops best rivalry. There's nothing current there thats compelling. there are some great NFL rivalries...PIT/CLE comes to mind. Nothing at all there currently compelling but its a great rivalry regardless.
Specific to NY/BOS...i also don't see how there's nothing currenlty compelling. The two teams have battled the AL East supremacy for the better part of the last decade, have the two most prolific teams in the game in terms of star power/big names anyway, and have a history.
Now I FULLY understand that too much of something gets tiring. That is definitely the case with NYY/BOS. But I don't see how one can make a claim they aren't still the best rivalry despite ones boredom with it. CHI/STL? You're really making the possibility Pujols becoming a FA and going to CHI into a "rivalry"? It adds an element of suspense maybe, but there are so many if's to that I can't see how it could even be considered. Heck, even if Pujols went to CHI, that wouldn't make CHI/STL a better "rivalry". It would be the Lebron equivalent and make it more of a must watch for sure, but thats not equivalent to a rivalry. And as far as there need to be something at stake...I can't see how one can claim there isn't. I dont' care what time of the year it is...I think these two teams have battled so much the past decade they don't look past any regular season game.
Finally, I equate your comments regarding the fan assualt making the SF/LAD games more of a "rivalry" to a car crash. Rubbernecking....compelling to watch maybe, but when was the last time the Dodgers were anything but a joke? Those two have history, and have been great rivals don't get me wrong. If both were competitive, and the Sox or Yanks weren't, i can see a valid argument that at the present time that rivalry would be better. right now though....the dodgers are a side show.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
and another thing..
while i agree too many games gets overdone and people get tired of it...too few games aren't good for a rivalry either. I hate hearing about how the Lakers / Celtics have been the NBA's greatest rivalry. I watched the 80's when both teams were great and had historic pasts. I watched present day as well when both teams have been great. At no time were these two the NBA's best rivalry, simply because they play each other so sparringly. In the 80's, BOS/PHI was a much better rivalry. Heck, in the 90's the Knicks/Pacers or Knick/bulls, Bulls/Pistons...those were all better rivalries. LAL/Spurs today is a better rivalry. MIA/BOS is a better rivalry.
The idea that the lakers / Celtics are the nba's best rivalry was never really one i understood. they just don't play each other enough. a couple times a year unless they meet in the finals. that doesn't make a rivalry.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dickay
i don't quite understand this logic. By this logic, there can be no great historic rivalries as they are always "in the moment".
I do acknowledge historic rivalries, just give me a reason to watch it. This is my argument with the Yanks-Boston. There isn't really a reason to anymore.
Quote:
One of if not the highest drawing NBA game this year was Lebron returning to CLE early season. Does that mean that MIA / CLE is the NBA's best rivalry?
No it doesn't. I really never considered that to be a rivalry because Cleveland sucks. Just like I never considered when Miguel Tejada left Oakland that Oakland and Baltimore would all of the sudden become rivals. The reason the CLE/MIA was such a high draw was more the fact they wanted to boo Lebron out of the building. Being successful also ties into what makes a rivalry something to tune in to.
Quote:
Storylines are one thing, I agree with you they draw attention and are great. But rivalries are something built up over time. They need a history. They may not be the most compelling game at the time, but they bring a ton of history which creates drama.
Rivalries can fade as well if there is nothing at stake. They may still be important to those who root for said teams, but not to those who are neutral to the clubs.
Quote:
Specific to NY/BOS...i also don't see how there's nothing currenlty compelling. The two teams have battled the AL East supremacy for the better part of the last decade, have the two most prolific teams in the game in terms of star power/big names anyway, and have a history.
It's easy to say that when you're a fan of either team. Tell me why I and any neutral fan should be interested. Maybe it's also the fact I live on the west coast that it really doesn't hold any value to me like it once did.
Quote:
Now I FULLY understand that too much of something gets tiring. That is definitely the case with NYY/BOS. But I don't see how one can make a claim they aren't still the best rivalry despite ones boredom with it. CHI/STL? You're really making the possibility Pujols becoming a FA and going to CHI into a "rivalry"? It adds an element of suspense maybe, but there are so many if's to that I can't see how it could even be considered. Heck, even if Pujols went to CHI, that wouldn't make CHI/STL a better "rivalry". It would be the Lebron equivalent and make it more of a must watch for sure, but thats not equivalent to a rivalry. And as far as there need to be something at stake...I can't see how one can claim there isn't. I dont' care what time of the year it is...I think these two teams have battled so much the past decade they don't look past any regular season game.
Not in all of sports like the writer of the article is trying to tell me. And yes the Pujols suspense adds an element of intrigue that is just not there with Boston and New York. If Pujols did go to Chicago and they were battling St. Louis for 1st, you bet there would be a lot more interest in that than something we have seen for the last decade.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
The fact that the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry is the most intense in baseball doesn't mean that you, or anybody else, should be interested. It's just the way it is. Rivalries don't have to attract the interest of non-fans.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HoustonGM
The fact that the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry is the most intense in baseball doesn't mean that you, or anybody else, should be interested. It's just the way it is. Rivalries don't have to attract the interest of non-fans.
thats how i feel. its not that i'm a fan of the team and enjoy watching it. i never watch Duke / NC. Its just a no brainer best rivalry in the game...even when NC isn't a top 25 team and there's no compelling storyline, other than the history.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
I would absolutely tune in to watch any BOS NYY series all the time back in the day when there was something truly on the line. Nowadays it just doesn't have the same impact as it once did.
Partly, that's due to having wildcard playoff teams. It's sort of like what someone else mentioned about Duke-Carolina in basketball. Sure, it's a great rivalry and all, but if you aren't fan of one of the two, what does it matter? They're both gonna go to the NCAA tournament, and who cares who wins the ACC title anyway?
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HoustonGM
The fact that the Red Sox/Yankees rivalry is the most intense in baseball doesn't mean that you, or anybody else, should be interested. It's just the way it is. Rivalries don't have to attract the interest of non-fans.
Is it really that intense? I don't feel like it is.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
Is it really that intense? I don't feel like it is.
That's because you're not a fan of either team. The animosity/intensity is still there in either fan-base.
Re: * * Official 2011 MLB Discussion Thread * *
pressure of the moment got to Gonzo there. Terrible at bat.
