http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=4938135
First case of a player being banned for testing positive for HGH (apparently). That's a potential gamechanger.
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http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=4938135
First case of a player being banned for testing positive for HGH (apparently). That's a potential gamechanger.
Thats great news!
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4938135
HGH test coming to minor league baseball.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4940922
NFL getting in on the action?
So...I'm like the only person that cares about HGH testing in sports, huh?? This is a way bigger breakthrough than steriod cheaters...in my opinion.
http://dberri.wordpress.com/2007/04/...rowth-hormone/
http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomi...her-should-you
And, a bunch more articles from J.C. Bradbury:
http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomi...h-hormone-hgh/
http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomi...ne-hgh/page/2/
And another:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...U5c&refer=home
Don't you know that HGH and steroids have absolutely no effect on performance whatsoever. Guys just risk all the side effects for the fun of it. BABBLE BABBLE. Not illegal in MLB. BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE. Greenies. BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE. Spit Ballers. BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE. Bud Selig. BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE. Ty Cobb. BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE.................Quote:
Originally Posted by KowboyKoop
Babble babble this has absolutely nothing to do with anything babble babbleQuote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
BABBLE BABBLE 300 IS ONLY A LITTLE GAY BABBLE BABBLE BABBLE I HATE SIDNEY CROSBY BABBLE BABBLE TY COBB BABBLE BABBLE BARRY BONDS BABBLE
babble
I think this was well said in fact. Perfect grammar. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
I don't think anyone questions whether they have ANY effect. I think they question HOW MUCH effect they have.Quote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
Also, a big reason that "nobody cares" is that it isn't just the ones that get caught that are cheating. No reason to punish McGwire so harshly for using when half the pitchers he homered off of were also probably using.
For steroids, yes. People certainly do question whether or not HGH has any performance-enhancing effects, as there have been many studies done that conclude that they don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by KowboyKoop
Yeah, and further, this is all irrelevant since this topic has nothing to do with what has happened in the past and nothing to do with the Hall of Fame, as all of MichelleWie's "comments" refer to.Quote:
Originally Posted by KowboyKoop
which were all misleading, because nobody has ever said that HGH "used alone" will provide performance enhancement. Yet people with an agenda try to use these studies which are irrelevant to muddy the waters and mislead.Quote:
For steroids, yes. People certainly do question whether or not HGH has any performance-enhancing effects, as there have been many studies done that conclude that they don't.
Where did MichelleWie say anything whatsoever about the hall of fame?Quote:
Yeah, and further, this is all irrelevant since this topic has nothing to do with what has happened in the past and nothing to do with the Hall of Fame, as all of MichelleWie's "comments" refer to.
This has all the makings of an 8 page back and forth.
nah, not with me anyway....been there done that. i'm not feeding lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989
All this means to me is that the new undetectable drug is already in use or about to be
Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
All topics that are commonly brought up when debating steroid users entering the Hall of Fame, and not brought up when debating what drugs should be banned.Quote:
Originally Posted by MichelleWie
Yeah. I don't agree with you, so I'm trolling. Clearly.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
Also:
Really? Nobody? Ever? Every single person that calls HGH a performance-enhancing drug is implying that it is only beneficial if used with other drugs? Not one of them means that HGH itself is a performance-enhancing drug? No. I think it's rather clear that many people believe that HGH, itself, is a performance-enhancing drug.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
(Disclaimer: If you're talking specifically about nobody on these forums, than maybe you're right.)
Thats not clear at all. You appear to be speculating, or dare I say putting words into peoples mouths. The latter isn't likely because you never do that.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
HGH is a banned substance. Not because its use alone is a performance enhancer but because its use is commonly associated with steroid usage. Thats where the benefits of the drug come from. The only people who view HGH alone as a performance enhancer are the ill-informed. Regardless, all that is moot. The point regarding your consistently bringing up tests that show HGH is not performance enhancing is the issue. Its highly misleading and irrelevant, because HGH ALONE IS NOT THE CONCERN OF MLB. The use of HGH alone is not being done. It makes little to no sense to anyone familiar with the biological affects of the drug.
Again to make it stupid simple. Talking about tests that "prove" HGH is not performance enhancing is misleading and irrelevant, because its not HGH alone that is MLB's concern. HGH is for lack of a better term, an amplifyer. Used with other drugs / concoctions / roids....it can provide significant benefits and helps players maintain while they cycle off other anabolic steroids. Find a test that studies that, and bring that to the table as that is what would be relevant to the discussion.;)
So...uh...many people. Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
(And, it's not putting words into anybody's mouth. If someone says "HGH is a performance enhancer." the default interpretation is not to add "when used with other performance-enhancing drugs...possibly" to their statement. )
You should stop speaking in absolutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
nice deflection and avoidance of the issue. :rolleyes:
ok, i'm done.
There's nothing more to say on the overall issue... hence, I didn't respond to the overall issue, but rather pointed something out that you said that I believe is absolutely false.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay