Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheNamelessPoet
Add
Johney U as well... He is a must dont ya think?
I dont know football like I know baseball at all... relativly nieve to FB
John U would be one of the closet as a QB to come to inner circle for me, Marino, S. Young, Elway, Montana all belong in the second ring of the circle, just my opinion, as I said before QB position is just too dependent on all of the other positions. Have a lousy OL, QB won't matter, Have little or no running game a good defense can make a QB not matter, look at Marino or Elway for most of their careers and fact of the matter was until they (Elway any way since Marino never got a running game) could be made to not matter by a good team.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
SirKodiak
Jack Lambert, LB
Randy White, DT
Walter Payton, RB
Joe Montana, QB
Johnny Unitas, QB
Sammy Baugh, RB/QB/DB/P
Deacon Jones, DE
Bob Lilly, DT
Joe Greene, DT
Anthony Munoz, OT
Ray Nitschke, LB
Dick "Night Train" Lane, DB
John Hannah, OG
Gene Upshaw, OG
Art Shell, OT
Gayle Sayers, RB/KR/PR
Dan Dierdorf, OT
Lance Alworth, WR
Mel Blount, DB
Lester Hayes, DB
Michael Haynes, DB
Raymond Berry, WR
Willie Lanier, LB
Willie Brown, DB
Chuck Bednarik, LB
Bruce Smith, DE
Ken Houston, S
Ted Hendricks, LB/Special Teams
Kellen Winslow, TE
Mike Webster, C
Darrell Green, DB
Dwight Stephenson, C
Jim Otto, C
Rod Woodson, DB
Entirely too big of a list for my tastes, I'd drop Art shell, Anthony Munoz was better in my humble opinion, I'd drop Montana and Unitas, although I do love the addition of Sammy Baugh because of his versatility, I'd also drop Bruce Smith, I thought he was always the lesser of the two players when it came to him or Reggie White, I like the addition of D. Stevenson at center, dunno how I forgot about him, I'd also drop Rod Woodson, again I felt Sanders and Green were both better even though Woodson had a fine and long career but he is second circle for me. I'd also drop Gayle sayers, too shot of a career to be inner circle, and for me he is borderline HOF anyway. Love the addition of Joe green, and Deacon Jones, also better than Bruce Smith to me and another reason Smith belongs in the second circle.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
You hear the term inner circle bandied about a lot when it comes to baseballs hallowed hall of fame. For football who do you consider the all time best football players regardless of positions? My short list of sure fire no doubt may God strike you down if you disagree hall of famers list would look something like this
Jim Brown, LB
Dick Butkus, LB
Jerry Rice, WR
Barry Sanders, RB
OJ Simpson, RB
Lawrence Taylor, LB
Ronnie Lot, S
Deion Sanders
Reggie White, DE
Darrell Green, CB
Anthony Muņoz, OT
Larry Allen, G
Mike Singletary, LB
who would you add or take away from my list?
Youve left off, Deacon Jones, Don Hutson, Ray Nitschke, Bob lilly, Sammy Baugh, Dick Lane --- They all rank ahead of (on your list) Simpson, Lott, Sanders, Green, and Allen
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gRYFYN1
Youve left off, Deacon Jones, Don Hutson, Ray Nitschke, Bob lilly, Sammy Baugh, Dick Lane --- They all rank ahead of (on your list) Simpson, Lott, Sanders, Green, and Allen
Yes, but that is why I said they were great additions:), Deacon Jones, Sammy Baugh that is. I am not sold on Bob Lilly being inner circle though I am on the fence about him. Question to you, do you think the inner circle must include a player from each offensive and defensive position?? I currently do not think that this need be the case, hence Lilly....
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Don Hutson gets no love.....
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
Yes, but that is why I said they were great additions:), Deacon Jones, Sammy Baugh that is. I am not sold on Bob Lilly being inner circle though I am on the fence about him. Question to you, do you think the inner circle must include a player from each offensive and defensive position?? I currently do not think that this need be the case, hence Lilly....
Well your list incuded Oj simpson, Deion Sander, and Darrel Green -- Which I consider Bob Lilly better at his position than any of them were at theres -- Lily was one of top 3 DLinemen ever.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
John U would be one of the closet as a QB to come to inner circle for me, Marino, S. Young, Elway, Montana all belong in the second ring of the circle, just my opinion, as I said before QB position is just too dependent on all of the other positions.
It has also been proven that you can still have a lousy QB even though you have some peaces in place. Besides Montana being replaced by Young, all the clubs drastically downgraded and didnt have the success with replacement QB's once these HOFers retired.
How does Marino belong in a 2nd tier? In his entire career, I believe only 2 seasons he had a RB on the club run for over 1,000 yards. You take Marino off those Dolphins teams, they are very much a 4-12 or worse team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
Yes, but that is why I said they were great additions:), Deacon Jones, Sammy Baugh that is. I am not sold on Bob Lilly being inner circle though I am on the fence about him. Question to you, do you think the inner circle must include a player from each offensive and defensive position?? I currently do not think that this need be the case, hence Lilly....
There just happen to be players that fit the mold.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
It has also been proven that you can still have a lousy QB even though you have some peaces in place. Besides Montana being replaced by Young, all the clubs drastically downgraded and didnt have the success with replacement QB's once these HOFers retired.
How does Marino belong in a 2nd tier? In his entire career, I believe only 2 seasons he had a RB on the club run for over 1,000 yards. You take Marino off those Dolphins teams, they are very much a 4-12 or worse team.
There just happen to be players that fit the mold.
yet the ravens won the super bowl with Trent Dilfer, and the redskins with mark rypken and giants with phil sims, why did those teams win with such mediocre QB's? (I am speaking mediocre relative to Marino) yet the Dolfins got nothing with Marino? they all had good player at the other positions, the ones that a QB is too dependant upon for success. That is why I call it the most dependant position on the feild. QB's get all the credit for when their teams win undesevidly so, as teams have proven over and over again it's easier to win with an ok qb and good defense, and running game than a so called great QB and be sub par in either the running game or defense
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gRYFYN1
Well your list incuded Oj simpson, Deion Sander, and Darrel Green -- Which I consider Bob Lilly better at his position than any of them were at theres -- Lily was one of top 3 DLinemen ever.
Joe green and Jerome Brown Howie Long were better imho
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
Joe green and Jerome Brown Howie Long were better imho
Id agree with Green, but not Long, Brown was a great DL, but its hard to judge a career cut short by tragedy.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gRYFYN1
Id agree with Green, but not Long, Brown was a great DL, but its hard to judge a career cut short by tragedy.
true, browns 5 years are probably too short :( but I also think leon lett was more unblockable than Lilly and against better competition...
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wassit3
yet the ravens won the super bowl with Trent Dilfer, and the redskins with mark rypken and giants with phil sims, why did those teams win with such mediocre QB's? (I am speaking mediocre relative to Marino) yet the Dolfins got nothing with Marino? they all had good player at the other positions, the ones that a QB is too dependant upon for success. That is why I call it the most dependant position on the feild. QB's get all the credit for when their teams win undesevidly so, as teams have proven over and over again it's easier to win with an ok qb and good defense, and running game than a so called great QB and be sub par in either the running game or defense
Those are exceptions, not the standard though. If we see mediocre or average QB's winning every other year I would be with you.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
I
How does Marino belong in a 2nd tier? In his entire career, I believe only 2 seasons he had a RB on the club run for over 1,000 yards. You take Marino off those Dolphins teams, they are very much a 4-12 or worse team.
The famous Karim Abdul Jabaar. And he was just over 1,000 I believe....
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ragecage
Those are exceptions, not the standard though. If we see mediocre or average QB's winning every other year I would be with you.
Agreed. The NFL is very much so a quarterback driven league.
Re: NFL HOF Inner circle players discussion thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OregonDuck1989
Agreed. The NFL is very much so a quarterback driven league.
I hate when people say that. Ok let's go through this simple exercise, name the last super bowl winner without a running game or good defense? Now name how many super bowl winner there are with a running game and good defense and an average QB, I bet the number of average QB's and good defense and running games out numbers teams with just a good QB but missing a running game. THe NFL is only a QB driven league in my opinion because that is who the media makes stars out of but when it comes to wining championships you better be able to run the ball and stop people period.
