Trade Rumors

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Originally Posted by dickay

forgot about the mags issue. yeah, he and Glavine both have very different situations than the Wells buyout issue which isn't an issue because it willl never happen with the amount remaining on his deal.

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Yeah I mean, they're more likely to just park him at DH and hope he gets some of that .850 OPS back that he posted on occasion. But if at any point they want to cut him, they're free to.

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Originally Posted by dickay

this is kind of dumb if factual. wouldn't the Jays be in a better position to recieve MORE VALUE if the recieiving team knew they would have a long term deal in place before acquiring him? why WOULDN'T you want to allow a team to have talks with him? it only increases what you could get in return.

i highly highly doubt this is some conspiracy where halladay goes somewhere adn has already agreed to resign with the jays in 1.5 years.

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If I were Roy Halladay, I wouldn't want to re-up with my new team unless I got a sniff of October pitching in 2009. To paraphrase the movie "Jerry Maguire" it isn't "Show me the money!", as much as it is "Show me October!". Sure, he'll cost quite a bit on his new deal, probably not much more than a 4 year extension though, but it's all about the playoffs baby.

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Originally Posted by actionjackson

If I were Roy Halladay, I wouldn't want to re-up with my new team unless I got a sniff of October pitching in 2009. To paraphrase the movie "Jerry Maguire" it isn't "Show me the money!", as much as it is "Show me October!". Sure, he'll cost quite a bit on his new deal, probably not much more than a 4 year extension though, but it's all about the playoffs baby.

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I think he'd have more leverage to get more coin now, than he might in the offseason. A team desperate enough to acquire him will pay more than a team that has other FA options available to them. If i'm Roy Halladay, i'm setting my price high and if they don't meet it, i'm not waiving my no trade clause. I'm taking the money, not worried about October. It'll be there because I get to choose the team i'm going to.

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Originally Posted by dickay

I think he'd have more leverage to get more coin now, than he might in the offseason. A team desperate enough to acquire him will pay more than a team that has other FA options available to them. If i'm Roy Halladay, i'm setting my price high and if they don't meet it, i'm not waiving my no trade clause. I'm taking the money, not worried about October. It'll be there because I get to choose the team i'm going to.

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That's precisely why the Jays aren't letting him negotiate first :p

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Originally Posted by haveacigar

That's precisely why the Jays aren't letting him negotiate first :p

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oh, i understand that. danged if you do, danged if you don't though....a team would give up more if they knew for sure they'd have him long term. TOR is leaving coin on the table....and it doesn't make sense since they don't HAVE to move him. He's not in his walk year...the leverage is all in TOR's hands.

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Originally Posted by dickay

this is kind of dumb if factual. wouldn't the Jays be in a better position to recieve MORE VALUE if the recieiving team knew they would have a long term deal in place before acquiring him? why WOULDN'T you want to allow a team to have talks with him? it only increases what you could get in return.

i highly highly doubt this is some conspiracy where halladay goes somewhere adn has already agreed to resign with the jays in 1.5 years.

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http://www.boston.com/sports/basebal..._jays_won.html

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Originally Posted by haveacigar

Well, they wouldn't be cutting him for a financial reason if he were still owed all the money. Wells doesn't have a team vesting option like Magglio, so cutting him would have no impact on his finances. I don't even know what the PA could even say in a grievance.

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Thanks for the correction, you and dickay.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

http://www.boston.com/sports/basebal..._jays_won.html


Thanks for the correction, you and dickay.

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i just don't see the logic for the Blue Jays in doing this...other than to ensure they make a deal even if its not maximize their return.

The article says its "precisely" like the Schilling situation. Thats not true. While similar...the D-Backs permitted Schill to negotiate, and the Sawx only made a trade AFTER they had a new deal in place.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1673350

Cashman was on the WFAN Tuesday saying basically what i'm saying. Its "easier" to justify moving top flight prospects, and alot of them, if you know for sure you've got the guy locked up long term. Teams would be hard pressed to justify moving as much as they could with no guarentees. Its how GM's get fired.

EDIT** In retrospect...what an awesome deal for the Sawx. AZ got basically nothin back (unless De La Rosa and Goss become stars, and i haven't heard anything about them). I think TOR should be a bit cautious not to repeat this type blunder.

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The Red Sox sent lefty Casey Fossum and righty Brandon Lyon to the Diamondbacks, along with minor-league pitcher Jorge De La Rosa and a minor leaguer to be named, reportedly outfielder Michael Goss.

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Originally Posted by dickay

I think he'd have more leverage to get more coin now, than he might in the offseason. A team desperate enough to acquire him will pay more than a team that has other FA options available to them. If i'm Roy Halladay, i'm setting my price high and if they don't meet it, i'm not waiving my no trade clause. I'm taking the money, not worried about October. It'll be there because I get to choose the team i'm going to.

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Of course a Halladay extension will come expensively (prob 4 years - $80 million or more), but he won't block a trade if he can smell October. According to him, he's happy with where he's at financially, even though in baseball terms, he's severely underpaid. What drives him is pitching in the playoffs and it should because he's the only active pitcher with 100 + wins who has never pitched in a postseason game and there are probably quite a few who haven't reached 100 wins yet who have. That's what he wants, a shot at the big prize.

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Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies

De La Rosa is with the Rockies now, he is a blah player

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He's frustrating more than blah. Great stuff but goes from dominating to terrible from start to start. He's had a few 6-8 inning starts where he allows 2 or less runs and strikes out a batter an inning, but also has an equal amount of 3 or lses inning starts where he allows 7 runs! :p

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Originally Posted by actionjackson

Of course a Halladay extension will come expensively (prob 4 years - $80 million or more), but he won't block a trade if he can smell October. According to him, he's happy with where he's at financially, even though in baseball terms, he's severely underpaid. What drives him is pitching in the playoffs and it should because he's the only active pitcher with 100 + wins who has never pitched in a postseason game and there are probably quite a few who haven't reached 100 wins yet who have. That's what he wants, a shot at the big prize.

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i'm not saying the Natinals. If I were the Blue Jays..i'd let him negotiate because I can maximize my return as a team will pay more for a guy under a long term deal. If I were Halladay, I would welcome this as i have far more leverage to demand big dollars now than i will in the offseason. I'm not saying he'll walk away from the PHillies, Red Sox, Dodgers, or Yankees...but they want what he wants...a long term deal. Of course first and foremost before talking contract Halladay will have to agree to that team as a place he'd be willing to go to, meaning they'd be contenders.

Its a win/win for all parties to do a new deal now. Thats why i think the inside scoop about TOR not allowing renegotiation talks is false.

actually...the comments in the article HGM posted are pretty good and summize my thoughts well;

http://www.boston.com/sports/basebal..._jays_won.html

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Makes no sense Tony.. did your "source" give any indication as to why? Or are you just throwing more theories on the wall again?

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Toronto must really not want to trade Halladay then. The biggest concern from teams giving up the amount of talent Ricciardi is demanding is that there is no guarantee that Halladay will pitch for you beyond next season. If Ricciardi really had intentions of moving Halladay, he would allow negotiations as terms of the trade. Otherwise, what team will be stupid enough to give up 3-5 top prospects when Halladay is likely to walk after the 2010 season? Even if he was simply trying to see what offers are out there, he just shot himself in the foot.

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Then a trade will not happen - Halladay has a no trade clause. He probably wont waive it unless he gets an extension from a new team. Toronto is just wasting everyones time.

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Then there is this post which baffles me. If true....i just don't understand WTF Toronto is doing, unless they are just sizing up the market and have ZERO INTENTION of trading him;

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Hey Tony, just an FYI ... JP Ricciardi went on the record about this LAST WEEK. Joel Sherman reported it July 8th after hearing it DIRECTLY from Ricciardi.

Seems like you need a better "baseball source" who can give you information on a more timely basis.

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I think you could quite reasonably ask for 3 top prospects/young players back for Halladay plus the two draft picks you'll get should you fail to re-sign him to a multi-year extension in the 1 and a half years you have to do so. Then maybe you throw in some maybe guys, but no less than 3 solid prospects. The huge market teams by wingeing and whining about this are leaving the door open to the smaller to mid-market to upper-mid market contending teams, who would love to have Halladay for a year and a half and take the two draft picks when he leaves town, having had no intention of a large contract extension in the first place.

Sanchez and Wilson both reject offers

First of all, why on earth would Sanchez accept that offer?

I realize Sanchez's worth, but he is going to likely hit his 8 million dollar option for next year.

so why would he accept 2 years for 10 mil?

Isn't it a vesting option though? The Pirates can do all sorts of finagling and keep him out of the lineup to hold down his plate appearances. Cheesy I know, but it happens: see Thomas, Frank circa 2008 Toronto Blue Jays. If I were an agent, I'd never go for a vesting option. It just leads to too much stupidity and friction between the player and the team. More likely, they'll try to trade both.

The Pirates should be glad the offers got rejected. There's no reason to sign those guys to extensions. I'm baffled as to why they're attempting. They've already made a few moves dumping older guys for younger talent and Sanchez and Wilson are likely going to bring the biggest return, and are older than the guys they've already sent away. They need to deal those guys NOW, not resign them.

I agree HGM...trade them already.

and action...wouldn't the union just file a griveance...not like you can't get around it though.

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Originally Posted by Jeffy25

I agree HGM...trade them already.

and action...wouldn't the union just file a griveance...not like you can't get around it though.

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How's that grievance for Frank Thomas goin'? ;) Unless I'm horribly mistaken, the union does not have the power to tell teams they must play certain players over other players. That would be forcing teams to play one union member over another and that has to be a non-starter for any union, not just pro sports.

I hope for the sake of Pirate fans Huntington will do the right thing and get some quality young players back, particularly for Sanchez, who's value is still quite high. Dayton Moore is such an idiot. He could've had a crappy hitting, solid fielding SS in Wilson, but nooo he had to get a guy who sucks at the plate and in the field and is locked up for huge money for quite a while.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

The Pirates should be glad the offers got rejected. There's no reason to sign those guys to extensions. I'm baffled as to why they're attempting. They've already made a few moves dumping older guys for younger talent and Sanchez and Wilson are likely going to bring the biggest return, and are older than the guys they've already sent away. They need to deal those guys NOW, not resign them.

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I would think that they "attempted" to resign them, and intentionally low-balled them, so they could say "Hey, we tried to extend them but they refused. Now we're forced to trade them."

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Originally Posted by actionjackson

How's that grievance for Frank Thomas goin'? ;) Unless I'm horribly mistaken, the union does not have the power to tell teams they must play certain players over other players. That would be forcing teams to play one union member over another and that has to be a non-starter for any union, not just pro sports.

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If there wasn't a valid performance reason for letting Thomas go, the union would have likely filed a grievance. Teams can't sit players for the sole purpose of preventing playing time clauses from vesting.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

If there wasn't a valid performance reason for letting Thomas go, the union would have likely filed a grievance. Teams can't sit players for the sole purpose of preventing playing time clauses from vesting.

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This. Sanchez is playing well, and if they randomly bench him for crap, it's not going to look kosher. Thomas was playing like garbage when he got cut, and Ordonez won't have a case when he comes in under his PA goals because he's also playing like garbage.

Hmmm, O's traded Salazar to Padres for Meredith. Could this be a precursor to a Sherrill or Baez trade?

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Originally Posted by asianinvasion

Hmmm, O's traded Salazar to Padres for Meredith. Could this be a precursor to a Sherrill or Baez trade?

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I'll bet this is the case. Huff will probably get moved too. To the Tigers, if I'm lucky.

Meredith will do well in Oakland

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Originally Posted by Jeffy25

Meredith will do well in Oakland

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That'll do him some good in Baltimore. ;)

oh crap haha...i for some reason was thinking O's as in Oakland....haha, nm

Okay, the Braves are in 2nd in the NL East, 6.5 back of the Phillies. They're only 4.5 out of the WC, but have 4 teams ahead of them. Wren, IMO, needs to decide quickly whether we are going to buy or sell.

If we are going to buy, we need to do so quickly. If we sell, then we should wait until the Halladay situation plays itself out, then look to unload Vazquez to the loser (or deal him at the deadline if Halladay stays).

I proposed this in the other thread, but would a package of Escobar, Freeman, Rohrbough plus one of Medlen/ Cody Johnson be enough for Halladay and Rios (I have no idea of what they need)? I don't see us parting with either Hanson or Heyward, but Wren has surprised me before. We could then get a cheap replacement (Lugo), or maybe unload Vazquez for one?

Anyway, just throwing it out there, and sorry if I'm rambling as I'm a little tired. ;)

Why is there so much chatter about the Braves trading Escobar? He doesn't seem like the kind of player you should be trading away. Is there some hot Braves SS prospect I don't know about?

The Rockies need to get a reliever. George Sherrill would be nice.

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Originally Posted by free2131

Okay, the Braves are in 2nd in the NL East, 6.5 back of the Phillies. They're only 4.5 out of the WC, but have 4 teams ahead of them. Wren, IMO, needs to decide quickly whether we are going to buy or sell.

If we are going to buy, we need to do so quickly. If we sell, then we should wait until the Halladay situation plays itself out, then look to unload Vazquez to the loser (or deal him at the deadline if Halladay stays).

I proposed this in the other thread, but would a package of Escobar, Freeman, Rohrbough plus one of Medlen/ Cody Johnson be enough for Halladay and Rios (I have no idea of what they need)? I don't see us parting with either Hanson or Heyward, but Wren has surprised me before. We could then get a cheap replacement (Lugo), or maybe unload Vazquez for one?

Anyway, just throwing it out there, and sorry if I'm rambling as I'm a little tired. ;)

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we ahve absolutly no need to Halliday... OBVIOUSLY every team needs a #1 but I am DEFINATLY happy with our pitching staff... we need a hitter... Medlen for Dunn... get it done Wren

Apparently, the M's are interested in Josh Willingham. Being on the Nats, I thought he sucked balls but after looking at his stats, he really isn't that bad and would fix our left field problems. Though, I think it would cost way too much to get him.

instead of looking it up, what would it cost? how much is willy owed anyway?

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Originally Posted by asianinvasion

Apparently, the M's are interested in Josh Willingham. Being on the Nats, I thought he sucked balls but after looking at his stats, he really isn't that bad and would fix our left field problems. Though, I think it would cost way too much to get him.

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Actually, Mike Rizzo doesn't seem to value him that highly. He hits very well and his defense, while below average, isn't as completely atrocious as it used to be. He would make a very good LF/DH for most teams. I hope the Tigers pick him up.

Matt Cerrone of MetsBlog.com wrote on Facebook today:

"Matthew Cerrone is waiting for the Mets to make news... something is going down today it seems, so keep an eye on MetsBlog.com."

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Matt Cerrone of MetsBlog.com wrote on Facebook today:

"Matthew Cerrone is waiting for the Mets to make news... something is going down today it seems, so keep an eye on MetsBlog.com."

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http://www.metsblog.com/2009/07/27/b...ound-the-mets/

wilson and snell are mariners

will the cards add a righty reliever?

is Sherril a Righty?

No

no, and the cards won't be adding anyone of that caliber...if anything, they may add some right handed AAA depth for september....it won't be anything large....a basic standard right handed reliever. I could see them focusing on a ground ball pitcher like Meredith is....they obviously won't be getting him....but someone like him.