I am one of five, yippeee!!!
Printable View
I am one of five, yippeee!!!
Sure you can. It happens here all the time. Or are you saying we can't bring issues into a debate that YOU'D rather not us bring in???Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
Yes, I can disagree to that. Judging from your own claims of being far right, it wouldn't surprise me if your father was far right also, which clouds his judgement a bit. I linked to evidence that the media isn't liberally biased above, just as you can cite "evidence" of the other bullcrap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
Would you rather me say bullcrap instead of ********?? (Since replacing the last four letters seems to get all eight asterisked?? Fine, calling the media in this country liberal is bullcrap. See? No astericks. And I find it funny that someone who used the phrase "OFG got pissy" as someone authoritative on objectiveness.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
Actually, you called yourself that, when you titled this threadQuote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
Actually, I'm betting you do, given your past statements about admitting being far right and Republican.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
And just below that another poster HGM, says he sees no liberal bias in CNN. Which there isn't. CNN is about as liberal as, say, Arlen Spectre. Moderately right, but considered liberal by the far right wing Republican Party today.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
No one said our media groups didn't tend to be staffed by predominantly democratic voters. That's very different from saying the actual messages getting reported is liberally biased, because it's not, no matter how many times you, your father, or Dickay, say so. I've linked above to FAIR, (Fairness and Accuracy In Reporting), and they've got further links to studies as well. But why bother posting them?? FWIW, here are several studies done by FAIR over the years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
You and Dickay will swear FAIR (and/or the studies they link to) is biased, and I will continue to say the studies and links from Dickay's post above is biased (it is). Where does that leave us??
In the words of Rich Bond, a GOP operative from years ago:
It was an admitted strategy, that was meant to "move" the debate. If they could "label" the media as liberal, and get it to "move" further right, then the entire debate shifts. Instead of a debate where you have those on the left arguing with those on the right which leaves a moderate center, then instead you have the moderate center (which always was the media) being labelled liberal, and in response, moving to the right, thus the debate becomes between the center and the far right, with the new 'middle' now being quite right of center. It was a brilliant strategy, carried out to perfection, and us gullible Americans bought it hook line and sinker.Quote:
Years ago, Republican party chair Rich Bond explained that conservatives' frequent denunciations of "liberal bias" in the media were part of "a strategy" (Washington Post, 8/20/92). Comparing journalists to referees in a sports match, Bond explained: "If you watch any great coach, what they try to do is 'work the refs.' Maybe the ref will cut you a little slack next time."
And it's still bullcrap. If anything, the media is conservative biased, because the strategy worked so well.
Are you really wanting to make people believe this argument based on one person's testimony? At least Dickay brought in like 8 different testimonies...your gonna have to do a little more research to try and prove that it is a conservative biased media...which i doubt many people will agree with. (and not conservative in junction with other countries...conservative via what the definition meansQuote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
Quote:
con·ser·va·tive (kn-sūrv-tv)
adj.
1. Favoring traditional views and values; tending to oppose change.
2. Traditional or restrained in style: a conservative dark suit.
3. Moderate; cautious: a conservative estimate.
4.
a. Of or relating to the political philosophy of conservatism.
b. Belonging to a conservative party, group, or movement.
5. Conservative Of or belonging to the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
6. Conservative Of or adhering to Conservative Judaism.
7. Tending to conserve; preservative: the conservative use of natural resources.
n.
1. One favoring traditional views and values.
2. A supporter of political conservatism.
3. Conservative A member or supporter of the Conservative Party in the United Kingdom or the Progressive Conservative Party in Canada.
4. Archaic A preservative agent or principle.
I find it logical to label the media to win votes, especially with the GOP. Heck they tried using fear to win votes against Obama. To discount that, I dunno man, I think youre off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
The one take away from this thread that I get is that the media must be doing something right. Their supposed to be absolutely neutral, and they are apparently succeeding since we're still "arguing".
Now if the Editorial staffs and ownership groups could only go back to not worrying about ratings (and therefore reporting sensationalist "news") then we'd really have something...
Dude, you were the one that brought the media into the discussion. Look back at this thread and see who brought up the topic of how the media treated Obama. I responded that THAT topic, that YOU brought up, was bullcrap. I did a search of the two biggest scandals (that I recall) that plagued the two top candidates, the Reverend Wright for Obama and the Keating Five for McCain. I did a Google search, and got NEARLY 10 TIMES AS MANY HITS FOR "Reverend Wright Scandal" as I did for "Keating Five Scandal". (See below). It's bullcrap that the media treated Obama better than McCain, if anything, they played his scandals MORE than the negatives of McCain. Go ahead, Google is free. Try it yourself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
LOL, seriously, after you called me pissy then just above this statement you used a four letter astericked word?? See quote directly above this one. Too funny, man, too funny. But I'll be glad to stop using the grade school language when others stop using grade school mentalities. Deal? BTW, Isn't M O R O N really grade school language??Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
I'm not really wanting to make people believe anything, other than the truth. And the truth is the media in this country is NOT liberal biased, if anything, it is conservative biased. Now I realize many out there don't want to believe in the truth, as evidenced by the good 'ole "Flat Earth Society" thread, and you and they can believe what you want to believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
FWIW, I didn't come in here "fighting" with you. It seems to me you're the one getting up in arms about my pointing out that the constant cries of liberal media is bullcrap, as though you were taking that personally. Fine, take it personally, I really don't care, though it wasn't meant that way.
The point is, you brought "the liberal media" into the discussion when you made this statment:
I responded, and will do so in the future when those of you on the right continue this nonsense, since I already quoted a former RNC head who admitted it's just a strategy to move the debate. And I'm having none of it, from you or anyone else. Take it personally if you want, or not, if you want.Quote:
We wouldn't be jumping up and down about it if the media didn't make him out to be some sort of savior or the one.
And again, YOU were the one that labelled yourself a far right conservative. I merely took you at your word.
Have a nice day.
And another little Google experiment.
Yep, that Obama has the media drooling all over him. EIGHT TIMES as many hits for "Obama Scandals" as "McCain Scandals".
The "liberal media" is a crock of right wing made up bullcrap. But bravo for them for making it work so well, now folks actually believe it.:rolleyes:
wait....so now OFG is saying that Google AND THE INTERNET are heavily pro-conservative???? Liberals have no chance now. Didn't Al Gore invent the darn thing?
Why is it that when someone doesnt' agree with you, they belong to this great flat society you describe? Sounds narcissistic, and I wouldn't expect that from you but i've seen this now a few times. Again, I posted numerous accounts & wikipedia links which had numerous studies which contradicted the argument you're making. I guess wikipedia is heavily conservative leaning now too, and belong to this flat earth society. ;)Quote:
I'm not really wanting to make people believe anything, other than the truth. And the truth is the media in this country is NOT liberal biased, if anything, it is conservative biased. Now I realize many out there don't want to believe in the truth, as evidenced by the good 'ole "Flat Earth Society" thread, and you and they can believe what you want to believe.
Dude, the quote I got above from Rich Bond, as well as the book articulating the conservative bias in the media CAME FROM YOUR WIKIPEDIA LINK.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
I can post several accounts too. Why bother, you aren't going to believe them either. Want me to just for grins?? Cause I know of at least TEN studies that have shown if any bias, it's a conservative one. Several of the studies were linked to in one of my above posts.
Like I said, you and others can believe what you want, it's all the same to me. Don't expect me to believe in that bullcrap though, cause I'm not, at least not until the media, you know, actually becomes liberally slanted.
lol, point awardedQuote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
Ah Politics....the unifying force of the forums!
**snicker**Quote:
Originally Posted by Alloutwar
So Rich Bond is a good person to quote but my own father isn't? cute.Quote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
and to follow up on your last sentence...that can be your opinion...but that is simply what it is....you opinion...an opinion is nothing more then just that. Just as my opinion is of the oppisite.
Actually i was replying to this comment by AOWQuote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
where else do you think we would have gotten this impression? that Obama was a savior or the The One? we didn't just make it up....someone had to help us think the way AOW described...Quote:
for you guys jumping up and down and saying 'look! he's not infallible! He's not perfect! Mwaha-hah!' What did you think, we're all sheep? That we felt Obama was the Neo-esque, real life equivalent of The One, flying about DC and kung-fu-ing the place into shape in 110 days? Holy projected idealistic ignorance, Batman.
OFG, you are seeming to have this belief that what your opinion is the be-all, end-all truth....it is your opinion, you are entitled to it, but attacking our opinions just because they aren't the same and then using references of degration to make those points isn't the best way to go about this...sorry.
I think you lost this debate in a lot of places, however, you have earned some good points at certain levels...but I think by and large you haven't acted as mature as I orginally thought you were. not because of your beliefs or opinions, but because of your way of presenting those.
he had me at hello, and then lost me when he blamed google & the internet for having a conservative bias.:rolleyes::cool:
Uh, care to show me where he did that?Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
Talk about mischaracterization.
I believe his argument has been that bias works both ways, and maybe pointing out that Jeffy and Dice arent open at all to the notion, well thats what im taking from this debate anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
and I'm actually done on this thread, I can already see his reaction...and there is no point in trying to reason with someone who has no interest in seeing the other side. I made a simple one sentence comment based on something that AOW pointed out, and it turned into this circus, which makes it very annoying and pointless to have a debate with someone who doesn't offer any light into their own den...I am game to learn the other side as well...but not when the person I would be learning it from doesn't appear to offer the same service.
Yes, I am.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy25
But ONLY because those on the right keep insisting that liberal bias is a FACT, be-all, end-all FACT. When I first made the claim that liberal bias is ********, both you and Dickay went nearly ballistic, because YOU'RE assuming it's a fact.
So, I'm allowed to play the same game, see. I will, as long as those on the right continue with their nonsense about liberal bias, continue insisting it's a fact that there is a conservative bias, and THAT's a fact.
Or, you know, we could all just agree that the media isn't biased at all (or very little either way) and act like adults.
But it has been those on the RIGHT who have insisted this as though it were fact. I'm just playing the same game.
[Edited]And Rich Bond was former head of the Republican National Committee. Was your dad??? He admitted, in a 1992 interview, that constantly calling the media "liberal" was a strategy to try and change the way the media covered things, and thus change the debate. A strategy that has worked well, I might add. According to several sources (FAIR is but one), the media, by and large, has moved to the right of center as a result of this strategy. And given current ownership and advertiser pressures, I tend to believe that much more than the constant bullcrap cries of "liberal media" when a former RNC Chairman admitted all that was was a strategy to change the debate.[/Edited]
Media is biased. Sean Hannity, for example...conservative. Rachel Maddow...liberal.
The issue is whether or not there's a systematic, significant bias, and I don't believe that to be nearly the case. Perhaps there's a slight bias one way or the other, but, as ohms_law said, the fact that we're even debating this is an indication that the media HAS done its job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
Uh..right here. He clearly tries to say that the media is conservative because they spoke about Obamas scandals more than McCains scandals and used google having EIGHT TIMES as many hits as confirmation. Apparently, OFG is claiming that google is ultra conservative. :rolleyes:Quote:
Uh, care to show me where he did that?
Talk about mischaracterization.
** i couldn't get the attachment to come up.
I never went balistic, it is YOU WHO IS MOST ADAMENT THAT IT IS NOT FACT!! Can you not see that you are just as much on this flat planet as those you're criticising?Quote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
Could you be anymore intellectually dishonest?Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
Yes, he's saying that the media has a conservative bent, and as evidence, using their coverage of the candidate's respective scandals. Until this thread, I had actually never even heard of that McCain scandal, while I was bombarded with Jeremiah Wright crap.
He is not saying "Google is conservative." What a load of crap that is. Where are you even getting that? He's using Google to show that the Obama scandals were covered much more than the McCain scandals were.
Yes, Dickay, I DO see that I'm being just as hard headed as those I'm criticizing. It's intentional, because IMO those I'm criticizing are being equally as hard headed that it's a given fact that the media is liberal.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
I'm sorry if that offends you (or Jeffy), as it's not my intention. It's just I'm damned tired of that constant chant that I've decided I'm going to act the same way, from the other side. Especially since, as I've stated above, if there were one side or the other that I would agree had a point, it's not going to be the side whose former chairman admitted these cries were a deliberate strategy. Given that, and the current ownership in media and advertiser pressures, if there were one side or the other that has an advantage in the media, it would be the right.
But yes, to answer your question, yes I do see I'm being hard headed too. Do you not see that those on your side are also when you insist the media is liberal as though THAT were a fact??? And you did insist just that, in an earlier post.
So you're insisting it's true there's a liberal bias in the media. I'm equally hardheaded in insisting there's a right wing bias in the media. I'm just playing the same exact game, from a different direction.Quote:
lol, you are so off based on this one OFG. It may bother you that this is true,
EDIT: And seeing as I've apparently gone overboard again and pissed off both Jeffy and Dickay, it's probably best if I take another sabbatical. Nothing wrong with disagreeing, but I do seem to have an ability to press the buttons that can get under folks skins. For that, it's best to take a break, methinks. Wishing everyone the best. OFG.
How shocking...the conservatives see a Liberal bias to the media. The (current) Liberal sees Conservative bias in the media. WOW! STOP THE DAMN PRESSES!
Incidentally, the next time anyone is stupid enough to ask 'why do they hate us?', point them to this thread.
:rolleyes:
:eek: HOLY **** WE IS GUNNA DIE! I BLAME THE POLISH!Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctic Blast
OFG, stop taking breaks! :(
I wish you the absolute best as well....and I wasn't offended, just don't feel like arguing about it anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
wow you're pretty naive.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
i'm being sarcastic here and showing his flawed logic. If he can make a claim that the media must have a conservative bias because they played more stories of the issue he took regarding Obama than the issue he took regarding McCain, then clearly using that same logic one would have to draw the conclusion that Google has a conservative bias as the screen shot he showed had Google with like ten times links to Obamas issue than McCains issue.
You can't have it both ways.:rolleyes:
Houston and Dickay=Best friends
I think you're being pretty naive. Either that, or you're completely failing to read OFG's posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
That actually doesn't follow at all.Quote:
i'm being sarcastic here and showing his flawed logic. If he can make a claim that the media must have a conservative bias because they played more stories of the issue he took regarding Obama than the issue he took regarding McCain, then clearly using that same logic one would have to draw the conclusion that Google has a conservative bias as the screen shot he showed had Google with like ten times links to Obamas issue than McCains issue.
You can't have it both ways.:rolleyes:
you didn't offend me, and don't think i've posted anywhere that should lead one to believe that??. Anyway, I do see what you're saying and yes I do personally see and believe there is a liberal bias. what i didn't understand is why you came in here so aggressively towards your view as I didn't see anyone doing the same otherwise. :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by OldFatGuy
only because you refuse to admit it.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
simple logic houston, if CBS news is "conservative" because it has less stories about McCains "issue" than Obamas "issue" than by that same logic Google must be "conservative" because it has less links (tens of thousands less) about McCains "issue" than Obamas "issue".
its a dumb argument thats not as acute as he was trying to make it.:rolleyes:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...as&btnG=SearchQuote:
Originally Posted by dickay
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...as&btnG=Search
Ten times as many hits for 'liberal media bias' than there are for 'conservative media bias'. That's probably why.
It doesn't follow because Google doesn't choose what items it shows, like the media does.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
Ok, wtf are you guys arguing about? Which media is more biased? They both are, get over it and stop fighting with each other goddam it.
Really, this entire 'debate' can be easily broken down as follows...
Jeffy and dickay : Media's liberal blahblahblah
OFG and Houston : Media's conservative...blahblahblah
Repeat ad nauseam. Weeeeeeeee.
I'm actually not saying that the media is conservative. I'm saying that there is conservative media and liberal media, but no significant bias overall inherent in the media.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctic Blast
this debate has (and slightly my own fault) turned into a grade school argument about petty simple ****...it's like alyssa saying we can't have a nursey in the one bedroom because the air vent hasn't been installed yet....getting pissy over little definitions etc. Anyway, sorry for helping drag on a senseless debate. It is fun to argue with OFG, i will admit that, even though I think he is closed minded, he probably thinks I am as well...oh well. all in fun, for me at least.