Kurt Warner and the Super Bowl

Can you believe he has been a part of perhaps the 3 greatest Super Bowls of all time?

St. Louis vs. Tennessee
St. Louis vs. New England
Arizona vs. Pittsburgh

Amazingly enough each game was decided while he was on the sidelines in the final minutes.

Mike Jones tackles Kevin Dyson on the 1 yard line as time expires.
Adam Vinatieri kicks game winning 48 Yarder as time expires.
Of course we know, Ben hooks up with Holmes with less than a minute left.

And another thing...

Warner holds the top 3 records for passing yards in a Super Bowl. Yet he has lost two of the three games. Makes you wonder how much more he has to do to get another one.

surprised nobody's chimed in in criticism that he didn't thank god for the fumble at the end :)

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Originally Posted by dickay

surprised nobody's chimed in in criticism that he didn't thank god for the fumble at the end :)

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Yeah thats a bit annoying when he thanks god for everything and he even says himself hes sure peoples tired of hearing it. But I dont hate the guy for that, he seems like a great family man and a really genuinely nice person. He is a great role model for kids and if I had kids of my own, I wouldnt be ashamed if they idolized a guy like that.

he has some fine ass daughters, if that's who those girls actually were. (I hope they are of age in saying that) lol.

I have to say, that St. Louis-Tennessee game is the most overrated Super Bowl ever. People forget how absolutely awful the entire first half of the game was. St. Louis was marching down the field every drive...then they'd go away from what got them there and run a different offense that didn't work. Meanwhile, Tennessee seemed to forget they'd ridden that Eddie George guy to the title game and tried to play chuck and duck the whole half. I think it was 6-3 at the half? Awful, AWFUL football. The 4th quarter was outstanding, but the game overall was pretty bad.

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Originally Posted by Arctic Blast

I have to say, that St. Louis-Tennessee game is the most overrated Super Bowl ever. People forget how absolutely awful the entire first half of the game was. St. Louis was marching down the field every drive...then they'd go away from what got them there and run a different offense that didn't work. Meanwhile, Tennessee seemed to forget they'd ridden that Eddie George guy to the title game and tried to play chuck and duck the whole half. I think it was 6-3 at the half? Awful, AWFUL football. The 4th quarter was outstanding, but the game overall was pretty bad.

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Wow I thought it was pretty compelling football, seeing Tennessee for the most part keeping that top rated offense at bay. Its still the best super bowl imo.

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Originally Posted by ragecage

Wow I thought it was pretty compelling football, seeing Tennessee for the most part keeping that top rated offense at bay. Its still the best super bowl imo.

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The thing is, though, for the first half I remember it not so much being great defensive plays that were stopping the offenses. The offenses were stopping themselves with bizarre, and frequently bad, play calling...ESPECIALLY in the red zone.

See, thats why I feel last year's super bowl is slightly overrated. For the entire first half we just saw Brady and Manning getting knocked around by some defensive lines and then in the fourth quarter the D's got tired...the fact it was the biggest upset in Super Bowl history and Tyree's amazing catch over rates the game.

This years and Super Bowl 32 between the Broncos and Packers are the top two super bowls I have ever watched both were hard fought on both sides of the football, both had outstanding plays back and forth by offense AND defense the entire game and both had great QB's dueling it out for the title in the end with neither wanting to lose.

Best Superbowl I ever watched was New England over Carolina and this years. Unfortunately, I rooted for the losers in both games.

And how was the last play a fumble and not an incomplete pass? And why wasn't it reviewed?

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

See, thats why I feel last year's super bowl is slightly overrated. For the entire first half we just saw Brady and Manning getting knocked around by some defensive lines and then in the fourth quarter the D's got tired...the fact it was the biggest upset in Super Bowl history and Tyree's amazing catch over rates the game.

This years and Super Bowl 32 between the Broncos and Packers are the top two super bowls I have ever watched both were hard fought on both sides of the football, both had outstanding plays back and forth by offense AND defense the entire game and both had great QB's dueling it out for the title in the end with neither wanting to lose.

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TOTALLY agree on the Broncos-Packers Super Bowl...what a fantastic game. Green Bay had that final possession with a couple minutes left in the 4th, driving the ball, down 1 TD...one turnover and BAM...Elway's got a ring. Great game, and Elways didn't even really have that great of a start.

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Originally Posted by 5dodgers5

And how was the last play a fumble and not an incomplete pass? And why wasn't it reviewed?

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If the ball pops out before his arm's moving forward, that's a fumble. To me, I think his arm start coming forward AFTER the ball starts popping out. And the play WAS reviewed by the review officials upstairs. If it had been more definitive, they would have called down to the ref to review it himself. Thing is, a play CANNOT be overturned without substantial evidence to back an overturn. The original call on the field was a fumble, and there isn't clear enough evidence to definitely declare otherwise, so it would have stood regardless.

But do you think Kurt is HOF material? He has been to 3 SBs.

Granted, great story and thank Jesus Christ, but do you think Jesus really gives a **** about FB?

Kurt is a HoF caliber player...however, like we were saying, he's going to take awhile to get in if he DOES get in. There are just way too many guys either coming up or already eligible to get in that are ahead of him.

Like the 3 from the same class. Rivers, Manning2, and Roethlisberger. While the Giants and SD bitched and moaned and traded, Pitt drafted Ben behind them. Ben now has two rings, is still a linebacker, young, and probably will get 1 or 2 more before he is done.

Great post.

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

See, thats why I feel last year's super bowl is slightly overrated. For the entire first half we just saw Brady and Manning getting knocked around by some defensive lines and then in the fourth quarter the D's got tired...the fact it was the biggest upset in Super Bowl history and Tyree's amazing catch over rates the game.

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It wasn't, though. Not even close. It wasn't even the second biggest upset in SB history.

NY Jets over Baltimore in 1969 is still the biggest upset , followed by the Patriots over Warner's Rams.

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Originally Posted by Swampdog

It wasn't, though. Not even close. It wasn't even the second biggest upset in SB history.

NY Jets over Baltimore in 1969 is still the biggest upset , followed by the Patriots over Warner's Rams.

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I'll give you the Jets over Baltimore...maybe. But your going to honestly say that the Patriots over Warner's Rams tops the 18-0 14 point favorite New England Patriots losing in the final minute to the New York Giants who started the season 0-2, their coach was on the hot seat all season, their QB being questioned on his play all year, and their team not even given a shot is a better upset?

Baloney.

Come on, the Boston Globe already had already started publishing the book 19-0.

The Giants over the Patriots is way bigger then the Patriots over the Rams. The Patriots over the Rams is a big upset, but it's not this big.

These New England Patriots were the best team in football's history. They had literally destroyed all opponents in their way. Brady and Moss had hooked up more times then anyone else in history. No one thought they could lose, not a single person. Meanwhile, the bumbling New York Giants had gotten hot at the right time and seemed to be just another pushover in the greatest season of the greatest team. Patriots over Rams doesn't even compare, in my opinion.


Let me guess though...Patriots fan?

I really enjoyed the Rams/Titans Super Bowl.

SB 43 doesn't even make my Top 5 Best Super Bowls, just because I think the officiating was so horrible.

Any superbowl with the Steelers in it will have bad officiating! Go SEAHAWKS!

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Originally Posted by Clay Dreslough

I really enjoyed the Rams/Titans Super Bowl.

SB 43 doesn't even make my Top 5 Best Super Bowls, just because I think the officiating was so horrible.

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while i don't agree with your second sentence...the rams/titans is one of my alltime favorites of which I've seen no doubt.

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Originally Posted by uncutsports

Great post.

Hey Guys,

Checkout the following link:

There are sausages in my pants.

Delivering you the News of the Sports World the Non-Traditional Way <- written on sausages, in pants.

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nice one dee! LOL!

The officiating was awful but I would still put 43 as my number one. Super Bowl 32 as my number two and then the Rams/Patriots, Patriots/Panthers, and Patriots/Giants rounding out my top five.

For me, Packers-Broncos, Giants-Bills in 1990, this one, last year's Pats-Giants finale and...I might have to go with Pats-Rams, would be my top 5.

Searching for 'sausages' on the Mogul forums returns FOURTEEN threads.

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Originally Posted by Arctic Blast

For me, Packers-Broncos, Giants-Bills in 1990, this one, last year's Pats-Giants finale and...I might have to go with Pats-Rams, would be my top 5.

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This was almost the exact same top 5 my friend and I came up with the other day. We had Rams-Titans in place of Packers-Broncos.

One. Yard. Short. Most unbelievable finish EVER.

That was payback for the "Music City Miracle."

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Originally Posted by Arctic Blast

TOTALLY agree on the Broncos-Packers Super Bowl...what a fantastic game. Green Bay had that final possession with a couple minutes left in the 4th, driving the ball, down 1 TD...one turnover and BAM...Elway's got a ring. Great game, and Elways didn't even really have that great of a start.

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I disagree totally, the game only had a great moment, when John Elway scrambled for a key first down on a drive to put them ahead. It was a good super bowl, but not great by any means.

What was great about the game, was at our Super Bowl party, when Denver scored their final touchdown to put the game away one buddy was like, well its over. Another friend said No it wasnt, and so they took a bet the game was over.

Right when they shook hands dude was like, you idiot there is 3 something left in the game, pay me my money. And he did lol.

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

I'll give you the Jets over Baltimore...maybe. But your going to honestly say that the Patriots over Warner's Rams tops the 18-0 14 point favorite New England Patriots losing in the final minute to the New York Giants who started the season 0-2, their coach was on the hot seat all season, their QB being questioned on his play all year, and their team not even given a shot is a better upset?

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The line before the Pats vs. Rams game was 21 points in favor of the Rams.

Last year was 7 points in favor of the Pats.

And I disagree because you are missing one big factor in your argument. The Giants played and nearly beat the Patriots in the regular season. So what you are saying is like saying Arizona beating Philadelphia is the biggest upset ever. Which teams have a better gauge on what you do when you play each other once or even twice for that matter.

But Swamps right in the end, the Jets beating Baltimore was the biggest upset in NFL history.

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

I'll give you the Jets over Baltimore...maybe. But your going to honestly say that the Patriots over Warner's Rams tops the 18-0 14 point favorite New England Patriots losing in the final minute to the New York Giants who started the season 0-2, their coach was on the hot seat all season, their QB being questioned on his play all year, and their team not even given a shot is a better upset?

Baloney.

Come on, the Boston Globe already had already started publishing the book 19-0.

The Giants over the Patriots is way bigger then the Patriots over the Rams. The Patriots over the Rams is a big upset, but it's not this big.

These New England Patriots were the best team in football's history. They had literally destroyed all opponents in their way. Brady and Moss had hooked up more times then anyone else in history. No one thought they could lose, not a single person. Meanwhile, the bumbling New York Giants had gotten hot at the right time and seemed to be just another pushover in the greatest season of the greatest team. Patriots over Rams doesn't even compare, in my opinion.


Let me guess though...Patriots fan?

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Patriots fan? Wrong again. And it isn't a matter of "opinion". Its a matter of fact. You seem to be using a subjective measure of what constitutes an "upset", and how big that upset is.

The size of the upset is not determined by things like how much a quarterback was questioned during the year, or by who the quarterback is dating, or by which team has the most highlights on ESPN, or by any other subjective measure. If you choose to place such a qualifier on a purely personal opinion...thats fine.

The biggest upsets in football are graded by the size of the pointspread. Period. Evidently, you haven't been much of a gambler.

There have been a total of five double digit underdogs who have won the Super Bowl outright. They are, chronologically:

1969, NY Jets beat Baltimore, Pointspread of 18
1970 KC Chiefs beat Minnesota, PS of 12
1998 Den Broncos beat Green Bay, PS of 11
2002 NE Patriots beat St Louis, PS of 14
2008 NY Giants beat New England, PS of 12

Let me state this with a caveat; While there are several sites that can provide this information, the odds themselves that are cited are often slightly different. This is because it is common for one sports book to carry a line of, say, New England minus 12, and the casino next door has New England minus 12½. There is nothing unusual about that. There is a general consensus among the major oddsmakers in Las Vegas, however.

Anyway, the 1969 Super Bowl had the Colts favored in various locales by a minimum of 16, and often by as many as 19 or 20 points. It was reported, at the time, that in the Baltimore area, the Colts were favored by as many as 22 or 23 points.

The biggest upset in SB history was the Jets in 1969...and there is no "maybe" to it. The second biggest was the Patriots upset of the Rams in 2002. The next 3 are in a group and are hard to separate, by pointspread.

These 5 games are the biggest upsets in the Super Bowl era.

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1969, NY Jets beat Baltimore, Pointspread of 18
1970 KC Chiefs beat Minnesota, PS of 12
1998 Den Broncos beat Green Bay, PS of 11
2002 NE Patriots beat St Louis, PS of 14
2008 NY Giants beat New England, PS of 12

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All great games, except I wasnt alive for the first 2. The odds were like Dubya winning a second term.

For my personal favorite of all time was 1990. Yes I am a Giants fan. Going into December, God (aka Phil Simms) broke his foot so Jeff Hostetler took over. Went on to beat the Bills and the Flipper curse.

Everyone is gonna have a favorite. Mine of course is gonna be the Giants in SB 25

No I'm not much of a gambler...seeing as how I'm 19 and in college...but your gambling way is your way of seeing biggest upset...mine is subjective (seeing as how you like to consider yours "fact" which in fact it...isn't. The Vegas Spread is not a God, it is not a fact book, it is still subjective to the people who make the spread... It's two different ways, seeing as how I like more of what is surrounding the game then the point spread itself (and seeing as how i could give a rats ass about the spread) I'll never consider it. The Jets over the Colts is the biggest upset, but I'll still hold Giants over the Patriots below it right there. Simply because it was the greatest team in NFL history going down.

And the Giants barely losing to the Patriots in the meadowlands in week 17 doesn't constitute to beating the 18-0 Patriots in the Super Bowl...evne though it is tough to beat a team twice...I would take Belichick in terms of strategy before Coughlin...hands down.

And rage...the Broncos-Packers game had more then Elway's helicopter...even though that could be argued as the greatest moment in Super Bowl history...its top five for sure.

It had the drama of Davis going out of the game with a migraine, the fact the Broncos could become the first team in history to lose five super bowls, Elway's possible retirement without a ring if they lost, Favre's Packers who were coming in confident and excited for back to back Lombardis, the Broncos were a wild card team they hadn't won their division they had looked mediocre all season.

It was 12 years ago so it's tough to remember but there was a lot of drama during that game. And it was back and forth all day.

But they pulled it out.

just curious if anyone has been on the arizona republic website. If not your missing some good stuff. They have a 12 picture slide frame of the holmes catch, and fail to realize that picture 10 and 12 clearly show Holmes toes touching the ground. When that is pointed out however in the comments, they just say it's at the wrong angle, and you can't really tell. Sad, that the media of a team can't be professional after a loss. Kurt Warner, and the team took it professionally, and I have all the respect in the world for that Cardinals team, but the media and fans are really hurting that teams reputation now.

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Originally Posted by lebsoccer02

just curious if anyone has been on the arizona republic website. If not your missing some good stuff. They have a 12 picture slide frame of the holmes catch, and fail to realize that picture 10 and 12 clearly show Holmes toes touching the ground. When that is pointed out however in the comments, they just say it's at the wrong angle, and you can't really tell. Sad, that the media of a team can't be professional after a loss. Kurt Warner, and the team took it professionally, and I have all the respect in the world for that Cardinals team, but the media and fans are really hurting that teams reputation now.

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agreed.

I think they should be banned from the super bowl permanently if they're going to continue to act like school children. ;)

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Originally Posted by dickay

agreed.

I think they should be banned from the super bowl permanently if they're going to continue to act like school children. ;)

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lol that would be funny.

"The Cardinals have won the NFC championship game...but due to their immature behavior...the Lions are going to the Super Bowl!"

How funny would a Cardinals Lions NFC championship be? Hilarious. :D

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Originally Posted by dickay

agreed.

I think they should be banned from the super bowl permanently if they're going to continue to act like school children. ;)

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lol. I wouldn't go that far, but it's sad that they are still talking about it, and cryin about it basically. If that isn't bitter, I don't know what is. The players took the loss with dignity and class, yet the fans and media are looking for ANYTHING to say they got screwed. What's next, the fans and media in Arizona suing the NFL?

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Originally Posted by lebsoccer02

lol. I wouldn't go that far, but it's sad that they are still talking about it, and cryin about it basically. If that isn't bitter, I don't know what is. The players took the loss with dignity and class, yet the fans and media are looking for ANYTHING to say they got screwed. What's next, the fans and media in Arizona suing the NFL?

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The phrase, "act like you've been there before" rings loud. I know they've never been there, but dang..........talk about embarrasing yourselves. I'd hide my hat for awhile if I were a Cards fan today. What a way to end a great season. :rolleyes::confused:

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Originally Posted by dickay

The phrase, "act like you've been there before" rings loud. I know they've never been there, but dang..........talk about embarrasing yourselves. I'd hide my hat for awhile if I were a Cards fan today. What a way to end a great season. :rolleyes::confused:

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Well, it would be an act if Cards fans acted like they've been there before, because they haven't. Unless you can find some Cards fans who have been following the team since they last won it all--which was 62 years and 3 cities ago.

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

No I'm not much of a gambler...seeing as how I'm 19 and in college...but your gambling way is your way of seeing biggest upset...mine is subjective (seeing as how you like to consider yours "fact" which in fact it...isn't. The Vegas Spread is not a God, it is not a fact book, it is still subjective to the people who make the spread... It's two different ways, seeing as how I like more of what is surrounding the game then the point spread itself (and seeing as how i could give a rats ass about the spread) I'll never consider it. The Jets over the Colts is the biggest upset, but I'll still hold Giants over the Patriots below it right there. Simply because it was the greatest team in NFL history going down.

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You're right about one thing. Your way is very subjective, based purely on bias and speculation. If you want to consider the Redskins "upset" of the Broncos in 1988 (as only 3 point underdogs) as the greatest upset in the Super Bowl, I guess you can. No one else will, but you can. You'd be wrong, of course. After all, they had a black QB, right? That must have been a gigantic upset....

Actually, the facts are, just that...facts. The pointspread (or betting line in other sports, like boxing) has been, and continues to be, the way that upsets are measured in sports. You originally stated

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...the fact it was the biggest upset in Super Bowl history and Tyree's amazing catch over rates the game.

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Again...it wasn't a "fact". You were wrong. Thats all.

Check out Elway's breakout season in 1993. Learn from that experience.

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Originally Posted by Swampdog

You're right about one thing. Your way is very subjective, based purely on bias and speculation. If you want to consider the Redskins "upset" of the Broncos in 1988 (as only 3 point underdogs) as the greatest upset in the Super Bowl, I guess you can. No one else will, but you can. You'd be wrong, of course. After all, they had a black QB, right? That must have been a gigantic upset....

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I'd be wrong? I guess according to you I would be...I see it differently, I don't see why you have to be all the time right in a debate on upsets, you do I mean there are TWO types of upsets aren't there? Gambling spread upsets and magnitude upsets. Such as Wake Forest losing to Miami in blowout fashion, the Patriots losing to the Giants a subjective magnitude upset, sure you can refute this with what you feel is of larger magnitude but that is your opinion, like a debate on upests usually is. Your facts are a gambling system created to increase bets on games not to become sports law of what is an upset, what I'm saying is that there are two types, my type I believe in, your type you believe in. But you have to be right, and that's cool I guess, but it makes you come off kind of jerk like...and after the last comment I'm not sure if I respect your opinion as much, if you use insults to display your opinion...I'm sorry for you.

The Black QB comment? :confused::confused: An attack on my Eli Manning comment? Because...I'm not quite following you on that one, I don't think Doug Williams race has anything to do with his play...ever. Classy!

Also, on the Elway comment first off: another classless statement, second: you claimed he "FAILED" for ten years. When in fact, he hadn't failed or struggled, he hadn't put up hall of fame numbers surely, but failed? Surely, no. Let's keep that debate where it is.

Honestly, you offended me, so I'm done. Learn from that, I guess. Class and respect are big parts of debate, as such I'll probably never debate you again, not that it's because you'll beat me or something, your intelligent and you know your stuff, you just debate like, frankly, a jerk. And I don't debate with that. Good day.

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Originally Posted by OregonDuck1989

But you have to be right, and that's cool I guess, but it makes you come off kind of jerk like...and after the last comment I'm not sure if I respect your opinion as much, if you use insults to display your opinion...I'm sorry for you.

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Yeah...insults. OK. I dont remember any insults, but, OK. I didn't realize that you were so sensitive. Please accept my apologies.

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Also, on the Elway comment first off: another classless statement, second: you claimed he "FAILED" for ten years. When in fact, he hadn't failed or struggled, he hadn't put up hall of fame numbers surely, but failed? Surely, no. Let's keep that debate where it is.

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I'm sure that you want to let that go, and I don't blame you.

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Honestly, you offended me, so I'm done. Learn from that, I guess. Class and respect are big parts of debate, as such I'll probably never debate you again, not that it's because you'll beat me or something, your intelligent and you know your stuff, you just debate like, frankly, a jerk. And I don't debate with that. Good day.

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Yeah, I'll "learn from that". Thank you so very much.

Really man, no one enjoys being wrong. If the debate boils down to opinion and nothing else, there is no right and wrong, per se. In that case, I attempt to support my view with whatever logic I can, and cite any available factual information as well. On the other hand, if the debate is over facts, then there is a right and wrong. I am wrong from time to time. I go from memory a lot, especially when I don't have the time to look something up. And if I'm wrong, then so be it. I can certainly admit it, and move on. There's no disgrace in that.

You, however, clearly are unable to handle being wrong. You cite things as "fact", and when it is clearly demonstrated that you're wrong, you either go silent "the Elway comments" or respond with this wounded routine.... as if your feelings are hurt. You aren't alone in this....there are many people that cannot admit to being wrong about anything, ever. Thats cool, though. Not my problem.

This is the internet. You post opinions, people are going to disagree with you. You make erroneous statements of "fact", others are going correct you. Thats all there is to it. Jeezus, I couldn't care less if you want to "debate" me or not. Oh well. I will tell you this; I post on what happens to interest me. Some of the time its an opinion, sometime it's providing some factual data. Agree or disagree, thats your prerogative. Once the debates over, its done. I carry no grudges against anyone here, or anywhere else, for that matter. Nor am I concerned about some anonymous teenager calling me a "jerk". Sorry you got your feelings hurt.

"Kurt Warner shouldn't make the Hall Of Fame because he played too many games indoors."

Discuss.

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Originally Posted by ragecage

Warner holds the top 3 records for passing yards in a Super Bowl. Yet he has lost two of the three games. Makes you wonder how much more he has to do to get another one.

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Be on a team that isn't as one dimensional as the Cardinals. The fact he's throwing so much shows their strength and weakness.