Are there more current/unelected HOF'ers

...then at any point in history? By unelected, I mean also recently retired.

Derek Jeter
Alex Rodriguez
Mike Mussina*
Manny Ramirez
Jim Thome
Frank Thomas
John Smoltz
Curt Schilling*
Tom Glavine
Greg Maddux
Randy Johnson
Pedro Martinez
Ken Griffey Jr.
Roger Clemens**
Barry Bonds**
Sammy Sosa**
Mark McGwire**
Rafael Palmiero**
Vlad Guerrero
Jason Giambi**(I think he'll reach 500)
Gary Sheffield**
Trevor Hoffman
Pudge Rodriguez
Jim Edmonds*
Albert Pujols (early days, but...)
Jeff Kent

I'm sure I've forgotten a ton

*Debatable
**May not get in for awhile. Giambi and Palmiero may never get in.

EDIT:I somehow forgot Mariano Rivera, and after looking at a page 2 article about the same thing, I see I forgot Bagwell and Biggio too. Apparently 1965 had 35 future HOFers playing.

Stick Trevor Hoffman on that list... and Carlos Delgado

And if you have Edmonds on that list, you should probably also have Steve Finley, who is shockingly similar to Edmonds, with better speed, but not quite as good defense.

You forget Mike Piazza

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Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies

You forget Mike Piazza

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:eek: I should've noticed that! :D

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

:eek: I should've noticed that! :D

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Piazza is also on the Page 2 guys list...about the only other one on his list I missed that I agree with will be Ichiro. He had this to say about Andruw Jones: (I think it was written in 2005)

"He's 28 and has 282 home runs -- only Alex Rodriguez (381), Juan Gonzalez (301), Hank Aaron (298) and Frank Robinson (291) had more through the same age. Ten Gold Gloves? Six hundred home runs? I don't see how he can be denied."

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Originally Posted by Pavelb1

Piazza is also on the Page 2 guys list...about the only other one on his list I missed that I agree with will be Ichiro. He had this to say about Andruw Jones: (I think it was written in 2005)

"He's 28 and has 282 home runs -- only Alex Rodriguez (381), Juan Gonzalez (301), Hank Aaron (298) and Frank Robinson (291) had more through the same age. Ten Gold Gloves? Six hundred home runs? I don't see how he can be denied."

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Jones getting 600 isn't a sure thing anymore.

And the sheer number of them will probably keep some of them out of the HOF. I have my doubts about Thome, Sheffield, Edmonds, Palmeiro, Mussina, Smoltz, Schilling along with a few of the steroid cases (such as Sosa that would definitely get in if it weren't for steroids). Some will say that players should get in regardless of who else is on the ballot. I disagree - the fact that there are many good pitchers should keep borderline cases such as Mussina and Schilling out. To me a player such as Thome or Sheffield doesn't belong strictly on a comparison to their contemporaries. I admit I would prefer a smaller HOF - I would be happy if the Hall admitted an average of two players per year. That means that you pretty much have to be in the top 10-15 players in the league for a sustained peak along with decent career value. And if that happens - a lot of these players aren't getting in.

History would suggest that there were at least 40 players active in the majors in 2008 who will get into the Hall. Of course, a few of them might well have been kids that got a cup of coffee in a late-season call up, or other young players who haven't done anything of note so far.

Of course it seems like there's more active Hall of Famers now than ever before...that's because, there is, because there's more players now than ever before.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

And if you have Edmonds on that list, you should probably also have Steve Finley, who is shockingly similar to Edmonds, with better speed, but not quite as good defense.

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They are not similar in the least bit. There is absolutely nothing similar about Steve Finley and Jim Edmonds, except that they were both center fielders. They were completely different players. I have no idea how you even come to the conclusion that were "shockingly similar", let alone similar at all.

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Originally Posted by kenny1234

And the sheer number of them will probably keep some of them out of the HOF. I have my doubts about Thome, Sheffield, Edmonds, Palmeiro, Mussina, Smoltz, Schilling along with a few of the steroid cases (such as Sosa that would definitely get in if it weren't for steroids). Some will say that players should get in regardless of who else is on the ballot. I disagree - the fact that there are many good pitchers should keep borderline cases such as Mussina and Schilling out. To me a player such as Thome or Sheffield doesn't belong strictly on a comparison to their contemporaries. I admit I would prefer a smaller HOF - I would be happy if the Hall admitted an average of two players per year. That means that you pretty much have to be in the top 10-15 players in the league for a sustained peak along with decent career value. And if that happens - a lot of these players aren't getting in.

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Thome is one of the best power hitters in history. He has one of the best HR's per at bats totals in history.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

Of course it seems like there's more active Hall of Famers now than ever before...that's because, there is, because there's more players now than ever before.


They are not similar in the least bit. There is absolutely nothing similar about Steve Finley and Jim Edmonds, except that they were both center fielders. They were completely different players. I have no idea how you even come to the conclusion that were "shockingly similar", let alone similar at all.

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Both had 300 or so HR, both were CF, both had above average defense.

And why is everyone considering Sosa as a steroid case? I've never heard any Sammy Sosa-steroids suspicion.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Both had 300 or so HR, both were CF, both had above average defense.

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And that is where the simularities end...

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Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies

And that is where the simularities end...

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Those are really the only places (besides speed) where people could be similar on a baseball field...

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

And why is everyone considering Sosa as a steroid case? I've never heard any Sammy Sosa-steroids suspicion.

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Really..., really?

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Both had 300 or so HR, both were CF, both had above average defense.

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Wow, is this a joke? Edmonds had 80 more HR's in 3 less season, but HR's doesn't make anybody similar. Edmonds has a career OPS+ of 132, Finley's is 104. Finley only has one season with an OPS+ higher than Edmonds career average. Edmonds has as big of an edge hitting wise as A-Rod does over Jeter, it's not even remotely close. And Finley has an FRAA of -12 for his career in CF, that's below average defense.

So Edmonds has a ridiculous edge hitting wise, and a large edge defensively, but hey Finley could steal more bases. It's not really close, Finley was just an average CFer, Edmonds was an elite one during his era.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

And why is everyone considering Sosa as a steroid case? I've never heard any Sammy Sosa-steroids suspicion.

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Originally Posted by YEAH DAAAAWG

Really..., really?

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Yes. Really. He's absolutely right. The only suspicion is because he hit a ton of home runs. There's no other players saying he was a steroid user (except Jose Canseco saying "Hey, just look at him"), no connections to online pharmacies, no mistresses saying he did steroids, there's NOTHING.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Both had 300 or so HR, both were CF, both had above average defense.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Those are really the only places (besides speed) where people could be similar on a baseball field...

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:eek: Wow.

First off, Edmonds hit 382 HR, Finley 304. Edmonds, though, had 2,750 less plate appearances. There's also Edmonds' .377 OBP to Finley's .332. Edmonds .528 slugging to Finley's .442. 132 OPS+ to 104.

Edmonds was better than Finley at everything except speed. They were not similar in any possible way, and you really need to learn more about baseball if you think the only parts of it are home runs, position, and fielding ability.

Heck, Edmonds in his prime was the best CF I have ever seen play defense, he was spectacular.

Wow, I didn't know Edmonds had done that well.

And HGM, is there a 4th part of baseball for a position player? Hitting, fielding, running, and ?

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Wow, I didn't know Edmonds had done that well.

And HGM, is there a 4th part of baseball for a position player? Hitting, fielding, running, and ?

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Well maybe you should do some research before posting such comments?

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Wow, I didn't know Edmonds had done that well.

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This is why you look things up before making statements, as I've suggested many times before.

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And HGM, is there a 4th part of baseball for a position player? Hitting, fielding, running, and ?

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Hitting is not limited to home runs.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Those are really the only places (besides speed) where people could be similar on a baseball field...

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What the hell are you talking about??? Are you saying that home runs are the only stat you can compare players with? What about hits, putouts, or ANYTHING besides home runs. There are hundreds of other stats to compare players with.

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Originally Posted by ragecage

Heck, Edmonds in his prime was the best CF I have ever seen play defense, he was spectacular.

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Him and Griffey Junior ruled the American League in the 90's.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

This is why you look things up before making statements, as I've suggested many times before.


Hitting is not limited to home runs.

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And I never said it was

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Originally Posted by Spitball

Him and Griffey Junior ruled the American League in the 90's.

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Dont worry, metsguy234 watches baseball and sees soccer :eek:

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

And I never said it was

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seriously kid you are making a fool out of yourself.

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Originally Posted by spitball

seriously kid you have made a fool out of yourself over and over and over, you should probably just scrap your account, get a new one with a new name and just start over..as is, you will forever be known as completely clueless due to the infinite number of times that you have shown a large degree of ignorance.

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fyp

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Wow, I didn't know Edmonds had done that well.

And HGM, is there a 4th part of baseball for a position player? Hitting, fielding, running, and ?

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Nobody tell him, I want him to figure it out on his own

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Both had 300 or so HR, both were CF, both had above average defense.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Those are really the only places (besides speed) where people could be similar on a baseball field...

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.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

.

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Well, their averages are pretty close as well.

Power, contact, speed, defense.

That's about it.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Well, their averages are pretty close as well.

Power, contact, speed, defense.

That's about it.

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Incorrect. You're missing the most important part.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

Incorrect. You're missing the most important part.

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Power, contact, speed, defense, and... consistency? Surely, we're not including pitching for the parts of a position player's game.

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Power, contact, speed, defense, and... consistency? Surely, we're not including pitching for the parts of a position player's game.

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Keep guessing.

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Originally Posted by HoustonGM

Keep guessing.

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Well, Steve Finley would've won in the Pitching category with 1 career MLB inning. (Seriously: http://www.baseball-reference.com/f/finlest01.shtml)

I assume you're talking about Range, isn't that included in defense?

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Originally Posted by metsguy234

Well, Steve Finley would've won in the Pitching category with 1 career MLB inning. (Seriously: http://www.baseball-reference.com/f/finlest01.shtml)

I assume you're talking about Range, isn't that included in defense?

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No....

Not pitching. Not range (which is included in defense).

It's the reason Jeter is so overrated...

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Originally Posted by wahoosamC

It's the reason Jeter is so overrated...

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:confused:

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Originally Posted by wahoosamC

It's the reason Jeter is so overrated...

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No... keep guessing, think Bill james...