I totally agree with that... He had much better numbers than Pedroia also. Though, the Yanks weren't a playoff team, so I'd still put Youkilis over my boy A-Rod.Quote:
Originally Posted by justanewguy
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I totally agree with that... He had much better numbers than Pedroia also. Though, the Yanks weren't a playoff team, so I'd still put Youkilis over my boy A-Rod.Quote:
Originally Posted by justanewguy
koolzach1, you're forgetting the key adjustment - position.
See, this is the nonsense that's not needed:
I hate this type of "analysis". For nearly any player, you can find a group of arbitrarily selected statistics and set arbitrary cutoff points so that he's the only player that fits the criteria. When you also add an award to the list of criteria, it gets even more ridiculous.Quote:
As Tony Massarotti of the Boston Globe points out, Pedroia was the only player in the majors last season to finish with at least 175 hits, 75 runs, 75 RBIs, 15 homers, 20 stole bases while winning a Gold Glove.
Carlos Beltran had 172 hits, but otherwise fits that. Grady Sizemore had 170 hits, but otherwise fits that (plus, Sizemore got on base 9 more times than Pedroia, but we all know walks are meaningless).
Nice sarcasm.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Also, who cares about position adjustment... (no offense) it is so stupid to give the MVP to a guy just because he plays a different position.
So, I assume that if Ryan Howard were a 2nd baseman, than he'd have killed Pujols in the NL MVP race.
This baffles me that anyone can look at the stats ot watch a Twins game and think that the Morneau is as close to a valuable to that teamQuote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Just to play Devil's advocate here (though i agree no one should have left him off) :Quote:
And shame on the voter that left Pedroia off their ballot completely.
One can interpret it by saying you can only have 1 player on the team be the most valuable; and its perfectly reasonable to think the Youkilis was more valuable to the Sox this year.
Why?Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
What Pedroia did offensively as a second basemen is more valuable than what Youkilis did as a first basemen. It's because of scarcity. It's easier to find a good hitting first basemen. The average first basemen is a better hitter than the average second basemen. Furthermore, good defense up the middle is more valuable than good defense at first base.
When discussing value, players need to be compared to those at their position. A .280/.350/.450 season wouldn't be anything special for a first basemen, but it'd be one of the better second base seasons in the league (assuming all other things were equal). In the simplest terms, it's harder to come by a second basemen with Pedroia's ability than it is to come by a first basemen with Youkilis's ability, therefore, Pedroia is more valuable.
He might have, but even then he shouldn't have (and that's assuming you mean "If a second basemen had Howard's stats", because Ryan Howard playing second base would be hilarious to watch, and his defense would absolutely kill his value). Pujols was heads and shoulders above everybody else no matter how you slice it. Chase Utley deserved to be way higher than 15th in the voting, and was way more valuable than Ryan Howard to the Phillies.Quote:
So, I assume that if Ryan Howard were a 2nd baseman, than he'd have killed Pujols in the NL MVP race.
Positional adjustment is very important to take into consideration.
The numbers that Youkilis put up as a first baseman were above average, but the numbers Pedroia put up as a second basemen put him in the upper-most tier of Major League second baseman.
The only second baseman who has an argument for being as good or better than Pedroia is Chase Utley, and FWIW I do think Utley is better.
I'd put Ian Kinsler in the conversation, if we're talking about actually like, whose BETTER. If we're talking about value provided this year, than yes, only Utley tops Pedroia because Kinsler missed a large portion of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by YEAH DAAAAWG
Utley is clearly the best second basemen in the game. That's not debatable. Then there's a group beneath him - Kinsler, Pedroia, Brian Roberts, Dan Uggla...and then everybody else.
FWIW, that group, I'd rank them Pedroia-Kinsler-Roberts-Uggla. I would put Kinsler ahead of Pedroia, but Pedroia's very good defense beats out Kinsler's sub-par fielding, but I think Kinsler's bat is enough to keep him over Roberts.
Cano will be atop of that discussion again after next season.
Potentially. He really needs to work on his plate discipline/pitch recognition.
Yeah, I agree, but let's not forget this kid's 2006 season (or even 2007 season)...Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
My questions is how can you be the Most Valuable Player when your teammate gets 2 1st place votes.
Sports really need to adopt two awards, one for the player most valuable to his team and the other for, simply, the best player.
Because there's 28 individual people voting with different opinions?Quote:
Originally Posted by gosensgo101
Maybe I'm as stupid as a rock, but I still cannot understand at all how the player that performs the best in a given season is not the player that provided his team with the most value.Quote:
Sports really need to adopt two awards, one for the player most valuable to his team and the other for, simply, the best player.
Now, that would be a discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by gosensgo101
MVP - Youk/Mauer/Pedroia
BPA - A-Rod/Hamilton/Youk
I agree. I used to think the same was as GSG seems to be thinking, but I've come around to what you're preaching, HGM.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM