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CC to San Francisco. Giants are going to break out the check book says Buster Olney. Not the Dodgers, not the Angels. His hometown is Vallejo, CA. 20 minutes from San Francisco.
This is great because 1) Im a Giants fan 2) I signed him the exact same way in my Giants dynasty. My Giants team may suck, but I have psychic abilities. I predicted it.
Go Giants!!! Beat L.A!!!
I don't see Sabathia going to San Francisco.
Why would they sign Sabathia when:
1) their offense is a mess
2) they have two great young starters already, along with a lot of good young back end guys
3) already got burnt with a long term deal with a starter(Zito)
Exactly. If they're going to pour money into a free agent, Mark Teixeira is the way to go (although you'd have to make sure Pablo Sandoval can handle third and/or catcher, or risk halting his development).
They would sign him . . .
1) They have the money to do it
2) CC is not Zito
3) They have talked about trading Cain for a Big Hitter, if not Jonathan Sanchez
4) Buster says that the new management wants to make a splash and do something big.
5) CC wants to come here. He is the one who said he wanted to play close to home. I can see the Giants doing this. May not be the best move, if they could actually get Mark Tex.
Buster Olney has never been smart, so don't trust him
He's pretty smart. All of the ESPN analysts know more then any of us about baseball. Whether or not they show it depends on the person.Quote:
Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies
And CC is not going to SF... He'll be in pinstripes next season
Point is that it doesn't make sense for them to add CC when they already have one of the top 10 rotations in the league while their bullpen is average at best, and their offense is one of the worst in the leagueQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
No, I would say most of us are much more informed and smarter than them in Baseball, and there is no way you can deny. 9 out of 0 of them AT LEAST are complete retards. Sure, maybe you don't know more, but I know most of us here doQuote:
Originally Posted by metsguy234
Not reallyQuote:
Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies
Look at Morgan, Sutcliffe, and miller..... We are definately more informed then they. They may know more about the interior goings of the game, and have some insider stuff, But they know nothing intelligent, especially about sabremetrics and statsQuote:
Originally Posted by defense
Yeah... watch out for the Giants... :rolleyes:
Will Bengie Molina be returning in the role of cleanup hitter? If so, the rest of the NL West better stock up on pitching.
Well Im not going to try and say what they know and dont because I dont know any of them personal. Im just commenting on what I read, watch and would like to happen. Cant a guy dream?!?! Jeez you guys know how to piss on a man's parade. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by RedsoxRockies
Don't be so sure of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by metsguy234
No he wasn't. Not at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by defense
I'd say metsguy goes too far in the direction of "They're smart" and you go too far in the direction of "They're dumb."Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSoxRockies
It really wouldn't make sense really ... the team needs depth on its roatation (Cain and Lincecum and a solid 1-2, and assuming Zito is the pitcher he was the last 20 starts of last year, hes an ok , but waaaaaay overpaid middle roatation guy)
The teams problem was power, they had no player with more than 16 HRS, and no player with more than 200 PA with a Slugging of 450 or an OPS over 800. (while the Dback, who were panned for a poor offense had 5 players that fell inot each of those catagories)
The ONLY way this could work is if they feel they can get Sabathia reasonbly below market ( say 6/100), and then be confident they could flip Matt Cain for a couple of power bats-- say to Florida...
I'd say that C.C. wants to pitch for a contender.
sign cc... trade cain for fielder, sign pudge... instantly can contend in the weak NL east
I hope they don't sign CC or trade for Fielder. If they want to make a splash they need to do it upgrading the offense, by signing Tex
Can Sandoval handle third base/catcher? You have to keep him as an every day player.Quote:
Originally Posted by rogue9
Exactly. I'd see him signing with the Dodgers before the Giants.Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Its obvious why CC wants to go to the Giants. He wants to hit cleanup.
lol
It remains to be seen, but my personal opinion is yes. Despite his weight he made some pretty athletic plays for the time he was with the big club. And he palled around with Molina the entire time, reportedly asking questions and talking ball most of the time. He seems to have the right attitude to learn what he needs to.
It isn't even close, Zito was way overrated and Sabathia's stats are way better:Quote:
Originally Posted by defense
Sabathia: 17-10, 253 IP, 10 CG, 5 SO, 251 K's, 2.70 ERA, 162 ERA +
Zito: 16-10, 221 IP, 151 K's, 4.53 ERA, 116 ERA +
you knwo the scary part... they SHOULD bat him cleanup lol. can he play the OF??? tahts how Ruth started. I say a team like Oakland (not them OBVIOUSLY) should sign them and DH him on the days he doesnt pitch. its like an extra bat in the lineup. Seattle would be PERFECT!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by asianinvasion
nab another very good pitcher and bost your offense... alto it would make elimination games dificult lol
And that understates that fact that Zito's peripheral stats were declining steadily each year. Take a look at his FIP's:Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Sox Fan 734
2000: 3.81
2001: 3.52
2002: 3.87
2003: 4.05
2004: 4.50
2005: 4.34
2006: 4.89
He's been at 4.82 and 4.72 so far withe Giants, but he had shown a decline prior to free agency and it was obvious that he was far removed from his Cy Young days.
CC is Getting Closer to San Francisco
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/brewers/34784059.html
Now what you guys got to say???
That Brian Sabean isn't the sharpest tool in the proverbial shed?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
LOL
They have to sell tickts some how . I tell you Im not going to want to keep buying tickets to watch Zito get blasted away every 5 days
It's not like they have a young, dazzling Cy Young winner that's incredibly fun to watch pitch or anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
Ok point there
But If CC WANTS to come here, Why not just go ahead and get him . Its not like they couldn't use him . They are trading Matt Cain hopefully for a nice power bat . They have money freeing up like crazy, its just Zito and Rowand that have big contracts . I think this move will show that they are serious about contending in the future . A step in the right direction . Now if they could get Mark Tex then Id say go there, but they cant . So I dunno what other moves they should make . I like it, so does everyone else I talk to out here.
However, with the Giants being as awful as they are right now, isn't this a team that should really just rebuild the roster? Last I checked, their batting order consisted of a bunch of overachieving hustle guys and players on their last legs...how is spending a ton of money on CC going to fix that?
They are? All I've heard is a bunch of unsubstantiated rumors. And there's very few power bats that I'd trade Cain for...none of which are available.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
How come they can't get him but can get Sabathia?Quote:
Now if they could get Mark Tex then Id say go there, but they cant .
Exactly. Their pitching is not the area that needs attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctic Blast
I'd rather have Matt Cain for the next 5-7 years than C.C. Sabathia if I had to choose one of them, especially since Cain is still improving (and he's younger than Lincecum AND has been in the Major Leagues longer) and would come much, much cheaper. Then they can spend that C.C. money on hitting. I doubt they'd have a chance on Mark Teixeira, but they could get a couple of cheaper, second-tier players instead. That's much more realistic than them getting Teixeira.
So would spending money on Adam Dunn, Pat Burrell, Rafael Furcal or Edgar Renteria make a whole lot of difference?
Why not at least pay money for somebody who wants to be there, hometown guy and a somebody the fans want to watch pitch?
If they sign a free agent slugger they wont be trading Matt Cain for another slugger so they will be in the same situation as last year just with a guy who hits a few more homers, but doesnt draw any crowd.
My basic point is...they're a REBUILDING TEAM. Spending a ton of money on ANY high priced veteran makes ZERO SENSE. Signing one or two players, regardless of who they are, isn't going to make this club a powerhouse. And if you're more than a few players away, signing a few for massive bucks on the free agent market makes no sense at all. Picking up solid guys who won't get massive dollars, and growing young players, is what this organization needs to be doing right now, not signing one or two bigger names in some pointless quest for .500.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
2008Quote:
Originally Posted by BINGLEBOP
CC - 253 IP, 17-10, 10 CG, 5 SHO, 251 K
Cain - 217 IP, 8-14, 1 CG, 1 SHO, 186 K
I have been watching Cain pitch since his 1st ML start and I dont think he really has gotten better, he may get better eventually, but he is the trade bait if they want to get a slugger. Not saying its what I would do, but its just the truth. He is on the block, period.
No. They shouldn't be trying to contend next year. The only free agent that I'd sign if I was them would be Mark Teixeira because he's young and has the right skills and profile to age well and thus can be an asset when the Giants are contenders (which is sooner than most think, but not next year, and will be further away if they don't focus on improving their offense).Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
The Giants were 11th in attendance in 2008, and that's without the Barry Bonds attraction. I'm not sure why you think they should focus on "drawing a crowd." They should focus on building a winning team, because winning is the best way to draw a crowd.Quote:
If they sign a free agent slugger they wont be trading Matt Cain for another slugger so they will be in the same situation as last year just with a guy who hits a few more homers, but doesnt draw any crowd.
What available slugger do you think trading Matt Cain, a 24 year old pitcher that has thrown 650+ innings with a 118 ERA+ and still has a ton of potential and room for improvement, for would result in a net benefit for the future?
I agree with alot of what you are saying, but MY point is that I am coming at this discussion as a fan. Im not dreaming of wild scenarios. This is what is going on and Im just giving my 2 cents from a Giant's fan POV. Signing CC Sabathia will bring the fans out, make a whole lot more money for the team period. Thats why they are trying to do it, make money so hopefully they can continue to REBUILD as they keep butts in the seats. They need some buzz, the kind of buzz the team had when they signed Barry Bonds, they werent instantly good when they did that, but they made enough money off the signing that they built a whole new stadium with private money.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctic Blast
That's fine, but for what C.C. Sabathia is going to get in the free agent market, and like others said, the Giants are REBUILDING ("not contending"), that's money that I wouldn't bother spending. They could just NOT spend that money and try to sign their young core to long-term deals when their time comes. No matter what, they're rebuilding and are going to go through some rough years, on the field, and in the stands. C.C. will end up with the Dodgers (contending) before the Giants (not contending).Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Perfect
You have a good point of view as what a fan wants, but fans don't usually get what they want during rebuilding periods. I was a Twins fan in the 1990's when they were atrocious... no amount of fan support will make a team start spending money.