Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
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Originally Posted by
justanewguy
Think about it for a second.
Think about it.
Seriously, you didn't grow up in a barn, did you?
I am torn between saying I agree, because I generally do, and... on the other hand, someone who has "never taken a drink" in their life is difficult to attempt to reason with on something like this, so I don't really agree with you.
The whole "if you stop doing it thing" only goes so far. Practically nobody does this as a thing. It's not like smoking your crack or beating your wife. It's something that HAPPENS sometimes. If you would think it through, you'd see that's the point I was making when comparing it to "unprotected sex."
It's something that people do in a moment, when their judgment is lacking. It's not something people TEND to do, or SET OUT to do.
It's an issue of lack of good judgment. Lack of good judgment can cause bad things. Talking on the cell phone while driving can kill people (and has been proven, in many studies, to be just as dangerous as drunk driving). Plenty of bad judgment can kill people.
It's a STUPID thing to do. Continuing doing it is STUPID. But it's little more than that, whatever the consequences. It's STUPID. It doesn't make you a bad person. It makes you someone who is capable of doing something STUPID.
You are right, it is not a 'thing' people make a habit of doing. Fact is some VERY good people have gotten DUI's after only a couple glasses of wine. It doesn't take much for some people to get to that .08. They often may not even realize they are intoxicated and still drive and those caught in this situation are often caught because of other things outside of their reckless driving (checkpoints, vehicle problems, ancillary accidents).
It is still wrong and irresponsible. It would not happen nearly as often if the penalties were more severe.
I have little to no sympathy for anyone getting a DUI....though I don't label them all bad people either. It often is a dumb decision....and yes sometimes those decisions are fatal. Good people make bad decisions. We can't all be as perfect as some apparently.
I know first hand that there is no amount of 'i'm sorry' that could be given to a parent who loses someone so suddenly at the hand of a driver who makes a bad decision. Cowboypoops point there is well taken.....however good people do dumb things sometimes.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Quote:
Originally Posted by
justanewguy
Think about it for a second.
Think about it.
Seriously, you didn't grow up in a barn, did you?
Also, I didn't say "same thing," I said "similar."
I am torn between saying I agree, because I generally do, and... on the other hand, someone who has "never taken a drink" in their life is difficult to attempt to reason with on something like this, so I don't really agree with you.
The whole "if you stop doing it" thing only goes so far. Practically nobody does this as a thing. It's not like smoking crack or beating your wife. It's something that HAPPENS sometimes. If you would think it through, you'd see that's the point I was making when comparing it to "unprotected sex."
It's something that people do in a moment, when their judgment is lacking. It's not something people TEND to do, or SET OUT to do.
It's an issue of lack of good judgment. Lack of good judgment can cause bad things. Talking on the cell phone while driving can kill people (and has been proven, in many studies, to be just as dangerous as drunk driving). Plenty of bad judgment can kill people.
It's a STUPID thing to do. Continuing doing it is STUPID. But it's little more than that, whatever the consequences. It's STUPID. It doesn't make you a bad person. It makes you someone who is capable of doing something STUPID.
Drunk driving and unprotected sex. Not the same thing. Not similar. I don't care what word you want to use..they aren't even close to being similar.
So...I can't be reasoned with on this issue because I don't drink alcohol?? Please, it's not my fault that you've had too much to drink and then got behind the wheel of a car. Seems to me I'm the more reasonable one here.
Your tone of "oh, it's just bad judgement" is what is so sickening. It's so accepted in our society as just a little mistake..as long as nobody dies or gets seriously hurt. It's not a lack of judgement...it's not just something that "happens." It puts other people's lives in danger. Trying to reason with me that "it just happens sometimes" is just pathetic. Go up to someone who has lost their child b/c of a drunk driver who wasn't even that drunk and tell them "hey, buzzed driving just happens sometimes." See what happens. Something tells me you wouldn't say that to them...because it's absolute garbage. Just because someone doesn't get killed everytime someone drives drunk doesn't mean it's less bad. It's an absolutely awful thing to do every single time...if it is something that "just happens" to you, then stop drinking.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Simply put, justanewguy is, basically right, and so is KowboyKoop. You both make good points.
I will say this. A person that has a couple drinks and then gets behind the wheel once doesn't automatically become a bad person. Sorry, but the world isn't so black and white.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
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Originally Posted by
HoustonGM
Simply put, justanewguy is, basically right, and so is KowboyKoop. You both make good points.
I will say this. A person that has a couple drinks and then gets behind the wheel once doesn't automatically become a bad person. Sorry, but the world isn't so black and white.
Does it make them a bad person? No. Stupid? Yeah. Shortsighted? HELL yeah. I sort of wonder about the people he was out with, too (I'm assuming there were other people). A few times a friend of mine has tried to drive after drinking too much, and we just haven't let him.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
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Originally Posted by
Arctic Blast
Does it make them a bad person? No. Stupid? Yeah. Shortsighted? HELL yeah.
It's a stupid, short-sighted decision, yeah.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
If you want to STOP DUI just do as in Scandinavia - introduce ZERO level tolerance.
That way it is simple & removes the hypocrisy & risk. You drink = no drive ....
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
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Originally Posted by
KowboyKoop
Drunk driving and unprotected sex. Not the same thing. Not similar. I don't care what word you want to use..they aren't even close to being similar.
I don't know why you are so adamant about their not being similar. They both:
- are heat-of-the-moment decisions
- are POOR decisions
- fly in the face of good judgment
- probably will not result in anything bad happening after one occurrence (this is just a statistical fact)
- are more likely to cause personal financial or health consequences than damage to others (sorry, it's true)
- CAN be fatal to others
I would almost be willing to bet you that AIDS has cost our country as many lives as drunk driving in the past 25 years.
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So...I can't be reasoned with on this issue because I don't drink alcohol?? Please, it's not my fault that you've had too much to drink and then got behind the wheel of a car. Seems to me I'm the more reasonable one here.
Nobody said it was your fault. You would make the more reasonable decision CONCERNING drunk driving. But you're not as capable of understanding or being objective about this situation, and, frankly, you are in the minority. It'd be like attempting to explain to someone who is a virgin how anyone could ever possibly end up having unprotected sex.
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Your tone of "oh, it's just bad judgement" is what is so sickening. It's so accepted in our society as just a little mistake..as long as nobody dies or gets seriously hurt.
Which is actually the overwhelmingly common effect of either unprotected sex or drunk driving. The vast, vast, vast majority of times people drive drunk, nobody is hurt. Again, I'd like to bring up cell phones. Cell phones are just as likely to cause accidents, or fatal accidents, as drinking is. Making a call while you are driving is STUPID, it's self-serving, but it doesn't mean you're a bad person.
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It's not a lack of judgement...it's not just something that "happens." It puts other people's lives in danger. Trying to reason with me that "it just happens sometimes" is just pathetic.
It is not. Try separating your emotions from this and THINK about it. I appreciate your concern, but I'm not advocating drunk driving, and I'm agreeing with you that it's VERY stupid, and that if you continue to do it, you're probably a bad person.
This is not something people do to do it. This is not a tendency. Someone who abuses their wife INTENDS to do so, and sets out to do so, and continues to do so. People who drive drunk will probably generally say something like "Oh, I'm not going to hurt anyone." They're being stupid. Not evil. Very few people drink and drive and consider it to be a "who cares?" type of thing, if challenged about it. And people who will drive drunk RARELY make a habit of it.
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Go up to someone who has lost their child b/c of a drunk driver who wasn't even that drunk and tell them "hey, buzzed driving just happens sometimes." See what happens. Something tells me you wouldn't say that to them...because it's absolute garbage.
I feel very bad for these people, but sh*t happens. It's part of life. Should you go up to them and instead tell them that the drunk driver was an evil, horrible person who intended to do such things? That'd be a lie, and it's not bringing anyone back. You're not going to say anything that means anything to such a person. You're turning this away from logic and involving emotion WAY too much. Again, the same thing could be said for cell phones, driving while tired, A LOT OF THINGS.
I actually WOULD tell them that "this thing happens." Because it does.
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Just because someone doesn't get killed everytime someone drives drunk doesn't mean it's less bad.
I never said it was. I simply said the INTENT is not there. It can't be compared to bad things like brandishing guns, spousal abuse, gang activity, violence... a LOT of things. These are things that make someone a bad person.
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It's an absolutely awful thing to do every single time...
I agree, 100%. But I don't think it makes you an AWFUL person. Please don't tell me you've never, ever made a mistake in your life that could have had a profoundly negative effect on anyone. Get off your high horse.
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if it is something that "just happens" to you, then stop drinking.
If it were a PROBLEM (which it isn't, with most people who do it), then yes. Otherwise, again, you're in the minority.
I'm not trying to be cold, I'm not even really trying to argue. I appreciate that you're a nice guy, and that you're taking the good side... I'm just trying to say it's not black or white or one or the other. It's a STUPID thing to do, but it doesn't mean you're a BAD PERSON.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HoustonGM
Simply put, justanewguy is, basically right, and so is KowboyKoop. You both make good points.
I will say this. A person that has a couple drinks and then gets behind the wheel once doesn't automatically become a bad person. Sorry, but the world isn't so black and white.
I agree completely, and KowboyKoop does make good points. I just don't agree with the vehemence or scarlet letter aspects of what he suggests.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HoustonGM
It's a stupid, short-sighted decision, yeah.
Pretty good summary of the average Human being,HGM.
Most humans are exactly that plus gluttonous/envious etc Dante was right when he wrote the "Divine Comedy" ,just human nature my friend!
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
This was a tuff one since I often get harsh on NFL players. Lots of people get DWIs.
Joba was driving a brand new BMW w/ dealer tags in bum**** Nebraska. He blew a 1.3. Yes he is wrong, but just think that where he was driving was a cop who probably just pulled him for 1) having a BMW and 2) was super bored. Would he have gotten yanked in NJ or Cal.? Probably not.
At least he did a mia culpa right away and didnt blame it on a Jewish conspiracy. that is pts in his favor.
On the flip side, one should never drive drunk. I have been super lucky all my life but stopped tempting fate a long time ago. Just look at Jim Leyritz from the NYY. He killed someone is probably going to get 7-15 years.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Arctic Blast
Does it make them a bad person? No. Stupid? Yeah. Shortsighted? HELL yeah. I sort of wonder about the people he was out with, too (I'm assuming there were other people). A few times a friend of mine has tried to drive after drinking too much, and we just haven't let him.
key word is 'too much'. thats very often not easy to tell. it doesn't take much for some people to get to that .08 lvl and many who have high tolerance levels one could never even tell without a breathalizer. Its not simply black and white. Fact is there are some who are just stupid, who get into their cars completely beligerant, and then there are some who didn't know themselves they were above .08. Are they both the same??? No. They both were irresponsible though.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FRENCHREDSOX
If you want to STOP DUI just do as in Scandinavia - introduce ZERO level tolerance.
That way it is simple & removes the hypocrisy & risk. You drink = no drive ....
agreed.
Re: Chamberlain apologizes for 'an error in judgment' after DUI
Quote:
Originally Posted by
justanewguy
This is not something people do to do it. This is not a tendency. Someone who abuses their wife INTENDS to do so, and sets out to do so, and continues to do so. People who drive drunk will probably generally say something like "Oh, I'm not going to hurt anyone." They're being stupid. Not evil. Very few people drink and drive and consider it to be a "who cares?" type of thing, if challenged about it. And people who will drive drunk RARELY make a habit of it.
http://www.aamva.org/
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Over the past quarter-century, the number of people killed each year on U.S. roads due to drunk drivers has gone down by 44 percent. While that statistic shows progress, roughly a third of all drivers arrested or convicted of driving under the influence (DUI) are repeat offenders, according to Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD). And those drivers are 40 percent more likely to be involved in a fatal crash than those without prior DUI convictions.
