Why Manny will retire in Boston...

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Originally Posted by dickay

So I think we are in agreement. Although I think it unlikely he'll retire a Sock, I don't think it impossible. As I said I could see him coming back to the Sox with a new 3 year deal. I also agree that the contract is about right.

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However, I think Boras and Manny have greatly overestimated his value. Remember when the season began and Manny had worked out all winter and was saying how happy he was and how he wanted to play for six more years and retire a Red Sox....I GUESS that was Manny's little way of telling management what he wanted. Apparently either everyone nodded and smiled like I did and said "Ok, ok Manny, calm down and we'll see what happens at the end of the year."....or maybe they completly understood what Manny was getting at and told him no effing way he was getting a six year contract.

Man I hate Boras.

I think that Seattle would be a great fit for Manny, but I doubt he would want to go to Seattle. I mean at DH, Manny or Vidro, not very hard of a choice. But Manny is still worth his contract. The problem thou, I see with Seattle Management, Manny will be worth his contract his first year, 2nd year maybe not...3rd and 4th...well all I can say is a la Sexson. Thou Manny is head and shoulders above Richie Sexson, the age will catch up to Manny.

Manny will get a 4 or 5 year deal, in that span, he will break 600 homers and possibly more.... He will bring fans to the stadium.... (a la bonds)

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Originally Posted by Pavelb1

However, I think Boras and Manny have greatly overestimated his value. Remember when the season began and Manny had worked out all winter and was saying how happy he was and how he wanted to play for six more years and retire a Red Sox....I GUESS that was Manny's little way of telling management what he wanted. Apparently either everyone nodded and smiled like I did and said "Ok, ok Manny, calm down and we'll see what happens at the end of the year."....or maybe they completly understood what Manny was getting at and told him no effing way he was getting a six year contract.

Man I hate Boras.

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I think anyone who thought at 36years of age that he'd happily take that one year team option for two consecutive years was nuts. The Red Sox most certainly knew it wouldn't happen.

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Originally Posted by Pavelb1

However, I think Boras and Manny have greatly overestimated his value. Remember when the season began and Manny had worked out all winter and was saying how happy he was and how he wanted to play for six more years and retire a Red Sox....I GUESS that was Manny's little way of telling management what he wanted. Apparently either everyone nodded and smiled like I did and said "Ok, ok Manny, calm down and we'll see what happens at the end of the year."....or maybe they completly understood what Manny was getting at and told him no effing way he was getting a six year contract.

Man I hate Boras.

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You can't hate Boris for taking advantage of the owners. You should hate the owners. Some stupid GM out there will try to make a splash and sign Manny to a ridicious contract.

I remember Clay wrote an article about how Manny was worth every penny of his contract....I'll find it :)

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Originally Posted by boomboom

I think that Seattle would be a great fit for Manny, but I doubt he would want to go to Seattle. I mean at DH, Manny or Vidro, not very hard of a choice. But Manny is still worth his contract. The problem thou, I see with Seattle Management, Manny will be worth his contract his first year, 2nd year maybe not...3rd and 4th...well all I can say is a la Sexson. Thou Manny is head and shoulders above Richie Sexson, the age will catch up to Manny.

Manny will get a 4 or 5 year deal, in that span, he will break 600 homers and possibly more.... He will bring fans to the stadium.... (a la bonds)

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not out of the realm of possibility.

So, let me get this straight. One complete jackass off the field (Bonds), but who has always performed on the field can't get a contract whereas one complete jackass ON the field (loafing, refusing to play, at times "somewhere out in left field"), can get $20,000,000 per year?? That about the sum of it???

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Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

So, let me get this straight. One complete jackass off the field (Bonds), but who has always performed on the field can't get a contract whereas one complete jackass ON the field (loafing, refusing to play, at times "somewhere out in left field"), can get $20,000,000 per year?? That about the sum of it???

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Well Manny is a lot younger than Bonds ;)

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Originally Posted by dickay

Yes, the option will be picked up to give Boston control over his rights. They will trade him to a team and he will agree as they will have a new 3 year 20 mil or close to it contract worked out ahead of time. I posted in another thread, but likely the Angels, Tigers, Mets, Astros, Diamondbacks, Rockies, White Sox, maybe the Dodgers, Orioles, Nationals, and a handful of other mid-market teams who think they can contend or improve marketability. Here's a sleeper...the Indians.

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Haha, maybe it would have been easier to list the teams that wouldn't trade for him?

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Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

So, let me get this straight. One complete jackass off the field (Bonds), but who has always performed on the field can't get a contract whereas one complete jackass ON the field (loafing, refusing to play, at times "somewhere out in left field"), can get $20,000,000 per year?? That about the sum of it???

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over-simplification

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Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

So, let me get this straight. One complete jackass off the field (Bonds), but who has always performed on the field can't get a contract whereas one complete jackass ON the field (loafing, refusing to play, at times "somewhere out in left field"), can get $20,000,000 per year?? That about the sum of it???

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No, not quite. Its amazing how easily you can sum up Manny's on the field performance in a few instances and use that as a collective for his entire career with Boston. The guy has to average pretty close to 145 games per year, 500 or so at bats and puts up amazing numbers. Yes, he's worth 20 mil per...every penny of it. Now the length of the contract is the issue. I do think his 'antics' will leave teams scared to go longer than 3 years on a deal as thats too much of a risk when factoring his age. Manny will try to get a 4th year, and maybe he'll find a sucker....but I see no reason he won't get 3 years unless the remainder of this season blows up to a real issue. I don't think recent events have been an issue at all outside of the media spurring something that should make sense to all of us. It's business, nothing more.

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Originally Posted by dickay

As for him retiring a Red Sox........who is the last big Red Sox player that retired while on the Sox?? Do we have to go all the way back to Greenwell (I know the term 'big' might not fit him much but he was a long tenured starter). I think Burks retired a Sock but that was a short one year deal after he floated around the NL

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Yastrzemski.
Greenwell was not exactly your standard retiree. No one wanted him in large part because he was a hardline union guy and therefore, trouble.

It's not like Manny decides to take a weekend off when the Orioles come to town. He's screwed up the Sox in a LOT of big games, sitting against the Yanks in big series' not playing down the pennant stretch, loafing in important divisional series. he's not a team oriented player, popular, lovable goofy b@stard, yes, but Manny puts an I in team too often.

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Originally Posted by robinhoodnik

Yastrzemski.
Greenwell was not exactly your standard retiree. No one wanted him in large part because he was a hardline union guy and therefore, trouble.

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I would put Jim Rice in before Yas then. He was more recent. Surprising you have to go back that far.

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Originally Posted by dickay

I think anyone who thought at 36years of age that he'd happily take that one year team option for two consecutive years was nuts. The Red Sox most certainly knew it wouldn't happen.

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To quote Dennis Eckersley, "shut up and play, you signed the contract.".

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Originally Posted by dickay

I would put Jim Rice in before Yas then. He was more recent. Surprising you have to go back that far.

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True, had forgotten about him. :o

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Originally Posted by robinhoodnik

It's not like Manny decides to take a weekend off when the Orioles come to town. He's screwed up the Sox in a LOT of big games, sitting against the Yanks in big series' not playing down the pennant stretch, loafing in important divisional series. he's not a team oriented player, popular, lovable goofy b@stard, yes, but Manny puts an I in team too often.

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I would agree he's not a team oriented player. The guys on record of being a hitting machine, thats all he does. He drew ire in the playoffs last year when (I can't remember exactly how it played out) after being something about how he'll feel if the Sox lose, he said he'd pack out his locker and get working towards next year...as if to say it wouldn't phase him. He seriously plays the game as a 'game' and doesn't stress when they lose.

I don't think its a lack of heart, I do believe from what everyones said for years that he trains as hard as anyone on the team, and I also think he plays hard **most of the time**. Perfect, absolutely not. But definetly not enough of a strain to put him in a situation where like Bonds nobody will touch him....and to be honest, the Red Sox would like to have him back as well. They just don't want a long term deal with him.