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The great rookies have faltered. Hughes to the DL (graciously) and Kennedy headed down. Will the Yankees finally bring up those rookies they have been grooming for the last 8 years? Even as a Yanks fan, it is their own **** fault for holding back on AAA prospects who should have been in the bigs 3 years ago. At least Mussina still has a pulse. I hope Rasner does too.:confused:
Hopefully the NYY despair, and as dark clouds gather over the Bronx a swirling vortex opens up beneath their feet, removing their stain from the American League. ;)
As long as the Halo's make it... one way or another, I don't care...
;)
It's still very early in the season, by the way.
they can't even decide on a name for themselves muchless win it all!?!?! (j/K) btw what ARE they calling themselves this week? The Lake Titttycaka Angels?Quote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
Huh??? What prospects are you referring to? Rasner???? LMAO!! Get ready for Igawa and a **** shoot.Quote:
Will the Yankees finally bring up those rookies they have been grooming for the last 8 years?
lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Wassit3
:p
Steve Philips said on ESPN the other night that since Hank Steinbrenner wants Joba in the starting rotation and Phil Hughes is struggling and injured right now, league GM's should have their owner call Hank and see if they can get Hughes on the cheap for a couple of relievers. Essentially go behind Cashman's back, is what he was saying. I wouldn't be surprised if one or more of them hasn't already tried this.
Yes Hughes has faltered. However Kennedy has not been sent down yet. There is no need to panic...they are only down 3 games! Wang has rocked! Mussina and Andy are not dead yet! I am actually more concerned with our hitting. Cano and Giambi are pathetic. THankfully Cabrera is doing great and others seem to be getting into the groove.Quote:
Originally Posted by grasshopper
Yeah, but the thing is... Steve Phillips in an idiot!Quote:
Originally Posted by beerchaser
Yeah, I aint too worried about our pitching either, Rick. Our hitting looked pretty good against SEA, though, so maybe we start getting hot, or at least start scoring a few runs a game consistently :p Cano will start hitting, as he is basically just unlucky right now. He aint striking out a lot, but just hitting lots of hard hit grounders and stuff... he'll break outta it. We'll be just fine. Rasner has TORE IT UP in AAA, and Igawa has been awesome. We have proven hitters; We have the best SP in baseball quite possibly, along with a very good #2 in Pettite; Also, it looks like Mussina has reinvented himself... again. Maybe Rasner can be our Aaron Small? :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
Who? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by grasshopper
He just was.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Wang has statistically been the best in baseball the last 2 years. Plus, since he developed his slider a lot last off season... he has been dominant this season. Cy Young... Book it.
No, he hasn't..Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Wins wise...Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Having the most wins != being the best pitcherQuote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Well I would say if you have more wins than anyone else you would be the best pitcher. So far Wang leads the AL in wins therefore he is the best pitcher in the AL.
Except...wins are an incredibly flawed stat. Wins are very offense-dependent. They tell you nothing about how a pitcher has pitched. Cliff Lee has been the best pitcher in the AL so far, and that's really indisputable..Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
Matt Cain was 7-16 last season. Dave Bush was 12-10. Was Matt Cain really worse than Dave Bush?
Yeah, but we all know that Lee won't keep it up.
Obviously, a sub-1.00 era is pretty much impossible to keep up for anybody, but to say that Wang has been the best pitcher this year because he has the most wins is just flat-out wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Thank God the Skankees are finally starting to suck horribly. They deserve every loss and every injury that they get.
Please note the Yanks are winning again today!
If I am trying to make the playoffs I would rather have Dave's wins verses Matt's better stats....Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Also I am arguing from the fan's perspective. I would rather have wins and a playoff shot than having a statistically better pitcher with no wins and no playoff hopes. To me as a fan most wins do equal better pitcher!
But the reason Dave Bush had more wins wasn't because of how he pitched...It's because the Brewers were a better offensive team than the Giants...If Cain got better run support, he wouldn't have had such a bad record...Cain had 8 losses where he allowed 3 or less runs, and 3 of those had allowed just 1 run. You're telling me that that's his fault he lost?Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
A statistically better pitcher will have more wins if backed up by a statistically better offense that gives him more runs.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
NYY = 16-16... getting ready to be 17-16
NYM = 15-13
HMMM.... Yeah dude, we're sucking really badly!
HGM,
19 wins in consecutive seasons plus a very solid ERA... CMW is a TOP pitcher, and can be argued as the BEST.
He's no doubt a very good pitcher, among the best, but it can't be argued that he IS the best when Jake Peavy, Brandon Webb, Johan Santana, and a number of other pitchers are still roaming the earth.Quote:
Originally Posted by koolzach1
Wang is very good, lets leave it at that. I'm not saying he is the best over the past year...and I'm not saying he isnt either. Right off the top of my head, he's likely in the top 5 or so. This from a Red Sox fan, who despises everything Yankee.
2006-2007, best ERA+, min. 320 IP:
Brandon Webb 154
Johan Santana 145
Roy Oswalt 144
C.C. Sabathia 142
John Lackey 139
Scott Kazmir 135
Erik Bedard 132
John Smoltz 132
Roy Halladay 131
Kelvin Escobar 130
Carlos Zambrano 126
Justin Verlander 125
Bronson Arroyo 125
Aaron Harang 125
Brad Penny 124
Jake Peavy 123
Chris Young 123
Chien-Ming Wang 123
Derek Lowe 121
Curt Schilling 121
2006-2008 W-L
Wang - 44-13
Webb - 41-18
Santana - 37-21
Oswalt - 32-18
Sabathia - 32-23
I'm taking Wang!
Just curious.....if you were GM of the Yankees, and the Mets offerred you Santana for Wang, right now, straight up....you turn them down? For Webb? Beckett? Others?
Only a Yankee fan homer dope would take Wang over Santana, Webb, and even Oswalt. He's got 44 wins because there's a 150 million dollar offense behind him. Put Wang on the Twins and he wouldn't have 15 wins.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
Oh, BTW....how'd he fare in the playoffs?????
At least as fans, try to act intelligent.
As a Yankee fan homer dope I would not trade Wang straight up for any of the other guys you listed for a couple of reasons: 1. I am a Wang fan. 2. Why trade a proven investment for someone who may do worse coming to the Yankees. 3. I'm not intelligent! :p 4. I am a Yankees Fan!
I like Wang - I like that the Yankees brought someone up, rather than buying a proven free agent. He is a great groundball pitcher.
However, he has to do it for a while longer before he's got a shot of being in the league of Beckett, Santana, all those; I don't see him as that level of dominance just yet. I think Jason Shields would probably do as well (if not better), if he had the Yankees offense every day.
But he is talented and doing very well; congrats Yanks fans.
Well put....as a Sox fan I say you maybe even undervalue Wang but you're analysis is much closer than those homer's in here talking like he's Koufax.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alloutwar
Hey, I can understanding liking a home grown talent who's performed well. But if you can't look past your homer bias, you probably shouldn't try to discuss baseball in a forum.
I was thinking more Guidry than Koufax!
This doesn't prove anything except that Wang gets better run support. Gee, i wonder why. He wouldn't happen to be on a team that routinely scores more runs than everybody else, would he?Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD
Yeah, I hate when teams "buy" their players... AKA, Red Sox with how many homegrown players on their team? Oh, yeah, that's right... Less than the Yankees :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Alloutwar
In the league of Beckett? Oh, you mean that guy that had a 5.01 ERA 2 seasons ago, and has a 4.19 ERA this season so far. Gotcha... I hope that Wang gets to his level one day :p
I would EASILY take Wang over Santana and Oswalt. Santana makes a ton, and has never pitched for the Yankees and proven that he could handle the Bronx like Wang. Oswalt... He is an NL pitcher, and isn't even at the level of Wang.Quote:
Originally Posted by dickay
How did he fare in the playoffs? Which year? The year where he had a 1.35 ERA, the year where he had a 4.05 ERA, or the year where he went through fingernail issues during the playoffs, and couldn't pitch his sinker effective?
He is 6-0 this year and if you look at the rest of the pitchers for the Yanks this year it means they (the hitters) are basically only supporting Wang if you go by that argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM