who do you think are the top two or 3 players at eacheveryday position today?
post your list here.:o
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who do you think are the top two or 3 players at eacheveryday position today?
post your list here.:o
A-Rod
Ortiz
and Pena were Baseballs best batters in 07'
so you think arod is the best 3rd baseman, ortiz the best dh?Quote:
Originally Posted by boomboom
I still think Pujols is the best hitter in baseball. He had an off year by his own standards, but he still has the best hitting skills IMO. I'll take a guy for whom .327/.429/.568 is an off year on my team anytime.Quote:
Originally Posted by boomboom
I don't think he's the best player, though, when you look at defense in addition to hitting. He's a pretty good defensive first baseman, but there's a reason he's at first now, too.
I'll still go with A-Rod as the best overall player, even though I've lost a lot of respect for him as a person over the last week. I don't have a problem with him opting out of his contract in an attempt to get an even higher salary--I'd say it was a smart business decision on his part--but the timing of the announcement was tacky, and doesn't even confer any negotiating advantage (that I can see, anyway) to excuse the tackiness.
yeah but is pupols n the top 3 at first base in your opinion?Quote:
Originally Posted by dps
Absolutely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wassit3
My top 3 all-around players at each position. (not in any order)
Catcher:
Russell Martin
Victor Martinez
Joe Mauer
First base:
Albert Pujols
Prince Fielder
Ryan Howard
Second base:
Chase Utley
Robinson Cano
Brian Roberts
Third base:
Alex Rodriguez
David Wright
Miguel Cabrera
Shortstop:
Hanley Ramirez
Jimmy Rollins
Jose Reyes
Left field:
Matt Holliday
Alfonso Soriano
Manny Ramirez
Center field:
Grady Sizemore
Curtis Granderson
Carlos Beltran
Right field:
Alex Rios
Nick Markakis
Vladimir Guerrero
Designated hitter:
David Ortiz
Jim Thome
Travis Hafner
Starting pitcher:
Jake Peavy
Johan Santana
Josh Beckett
Relief pitcher:
Jonathan Papelbon
J.J. Putz
Joe Nathan
Vladimir Guerrero
If Ichiro goes back to RF, I would put him in Houstons ranking.
as a centerfielder is he good, but with an arm he has he would be better off in right.
Catcher:
1. Joe Mauer
2. Victor Martinez
3. Russel Martin
First base:
1. Albert Pujols
2. Mark Teixeira
3. Prince Fielder
Second base:
1. Chase Utley
2. Robinson Cano
3. Dustin Pedroia (call me a homer but hes a helluva hitter and has a great glove)
Third base:
1. Alex Rodriguez
2. Miguel Cabrera
3. David Wright
Shortstop:
1. Hanley Ramirez
2. Jose Reyes
3. Jimmy Rollins
Left field:
1. Matt Holliday
2. Carl Crawford
3. Manny Ramirez
Center field:
1. Carlos Beltran
2. Grady Sizemore
3. Curtis Granderson
Right field:
1. Nick Markakis
2. Magglio Ordonez
3. Alex Rios
Designated Hitter:
1. David Ortiz
2. Travis Hafner
3. Jim Thome
Starting Pitcher:
1. Johan Santana
2. Josh Beckett
3. Jake Peavy
Relief Pitcher:
1. Jon Papelbon
2. Joe Nathan
3. Fransisco Rodriguez
Just Insert a Yankee at every position and my list is done!
:DQuote:
Originally Posted by RickD
Not a bad list, but you have a strange fixation on pitchers whose first name starts with "J". :DQuote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
I'd like to add Youkilis into the discussion. He's not the 40 hr type of hitter but he plays gold glove defense, bats around .280-.290 and is on base around 40% of the time. Plus he only made $424,500 and owns two WS rings already. Two rings in a four year career, not too shabby.
Derek Lee is twice as good as Youkilis
It's great how much being on the right team at the right team can boost your value.Quote:
Originally Posted by robinhoodnik
Youkilis is a great player, but the number of rings he has means nothing to how good of a player he is. Ramiro Mendoza has a few rings too.
It has something to do it, but on an individual stance, rings mean nothing...well only when HOF discussion comes ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
To me, a ring means how good the team is/was (duh), and to play for that team, that season you were one of the 25 men who played on a championship team.
I mean if Edgar Martinez one a few championships in the 90s with Seattle...he would have a shot at the HOF. More-so then now.
If Dwight Evans and Jim Rice won a championship...would they be in the HOF?
True... Jim Rice should be in the hall anyway, though. Martinez and Evans, not so much.
Nothing personal against Youkilis but I don't see him anywhere near the top 3. I'm admittedly biased being a Dodgers fan but I'd take James Loney way ahead of Youkilis.
With Edgar thou, sorry to take this off the subject. If you look say from 92' - 2002, that was one heck of a 10 year run. His OBP and Batting average were high, and at the age of 37, he was still hitting the cover off the ball. Edgar will make it in one day.
Evans one of the top 10 players in the 80's. A 30 homerun season was very valueable then.Quote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
I'd put Martinez and Evans in before Rice. Actually, I think all 3 should probably be in, though all of them are somewhat marginal candidates. I just think that Rice is the most problematic.Quote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
Martinez would be a stronger candidate if injuries hadn't kept him from staying at 3rd, but if we induct everybody whose career we can attach an "if only" to, we'll need to start inducting 10-15 guys every year.
Rice/Evans combo was one of the best in history in the 80's.
As for Edgar even with injuries, he piled up some good career numbers.
Interesting. I'd be really interested in hearing the reasoning behind "I just think that Rice is the most problematic."
Personally, I'm a big Black Ink type of person. It's certainly not a foolproof, end all, be all measure by any means. However, it does provide a good unbiased starting point. All three are marginal (especially considering that they were all mainly DH's), and with more choices in the mix it wold likely be easy to overlook all of them. However, just between the three of them, Jim Rice leads by a country mile in Black Ink. Considering their whole work though, I'd have to give it to Rice. I mean sure, he played a couple fewer years then Evans. Evans was a bit more disciplined at the plate as well. You just can't ignore the difference in power (and not just home runs, either. total power) and Rice has a slight edge in contact as well.
The biggest things for me though are that Rice had more speed (doubles and triples), and most importantly he was much more consistent. His deltas (change in rate stats) are much smaller from year to year than Evans' are. You can't buy that consistency, and you can't teach it either. That's pure skill.
Jim Rice was also greatly consistent at making multiple outs with one swing ;)
Evans was better than Rice. Evans was just as valuable at the plate, and one of the best right fielders in his time. Absolute cannon for an arm too.Quote:
Originally Posted by boomboom
Right. Rice didn't want to wear glasses, and that alone probably cost him his HOF place. If only.....:(Quote:
Originally Posted by dps
Also consistent at putting multiple runs on the board with one swing.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
I don't dispute the importance of OBP, by any means. You know that.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
However, I'll gladly accept a 10 or 20 point loss in OBP for almost 100 points in slugging any time. Especially when that slugging is primarily doubles and triples from a guy who seems to be able to put the ball in play where it needs to go. Not only that, but I'd never have to worry about Jim Rice's performance. The guy was obviously a workhorse with tons of natural talent. Just look at the consistency of all of his rate stats... the guy basically hit his career averages every single year that he played (with the obvious exceptions of '74 and '89). That's just awesome.
I wasn't referring to OBP.Quote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
I was referring to double plays, hence multiple outs with one swing. :p
isn't this supposed to be about players in MLB TODAY!!! lol
OK, but he didn't hit into that many double plays. He consistently hit into double plays right around the 10% mark, which is about average overall.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Besides, like robin mentioned, he made up for it. He was hitting in the 4 hole for most of his career, after all.
meh.. this is more fun!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wassit3
:D
I know lol when will we behearing from the dave kingman for the HOF camp?? anybody? hellooooooo??? (chirpchirp chirp)....:DQuote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
OK: Dave Kingman, not even close.
;)
If Kingman hadn't been blackballed he'd have been an interesting case though wouldn't he have been? He certainly would have passed the magical 500 homerun mark.
He holds the top two single season marks, as well as tied for 6th and 15th, and he's 6th on the all time list. The players ahead of him Eddie Murray, Dave Winfield, Hank Aaron, Carl Yastrzemski, and Cal Ripken all had roughly 3,000 or more at bats.Quote:
Originally Posted by ohms_law
Oh god, I wouldn't want ANY of those guys on my team...Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM
Poor fielding and he couldn't actually hit (despite getting home runs). He's probably one of the worst of the elite power hitters in the history of the game.
Jim Rice had nearly as many double plays as all 5 of those players in 3,000+ less at bats. Their high career totals are mostly due to longevity.Quote:
Originally Posted by robinhoodnik
Look a the rates rather than the counts. I think you'll find it fairly reveling.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonGM