Torre still the right guy for the job in NY?

I LOVE Joe Torre, but he needs to go. For those of you that were around when he managed the Mets, Cardinals or Braves, you realize that he is not a great "baseball mind".

Torre has been handed the best lineup in baseball from year-to-year and he has really underachieved in most of them (they should win 110 games every year with those lineups). I would argue that the pitching he has been given to work with has been horrible (which makes me question why Cashman is still around), but a lineup that good should be able to win 100 games with 5 mediocre pitchers (obviously more when you add good pitchers to the mix).

Don't forget, even Barry Switzer won a Super Bowl with a GREAT team.

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Originally Posted by coloradoexpress

I LOVE Joe Torre, but he needs to go. For those of you that were around when he managed the Mets, Cardinals or Braves, you realize that he is not a great "baseball mind".

Torre has been handed the best lineup in baseball from year-to-year and he has really underachieved in most of them (they should win 110 games every year with those lineups).

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Well he has been in post season nearly every year so winning 120 or 90 games means little (only having Home field advantage as they did this year..)

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Originally Posted by coloradoexpress

I would argue that the pitching he has been given to work with has been horrible (which makes me question why Cashman is still around), but a lineup that good should be able to win 100 games with 5 mediocre pitchers (obviously more when you add good pitchers to the mix).

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Not always been Cashman's call - also due to the "barren" minor system the Yankees have not been able to "trade" effectively as other teams (like prospect rich Dodgers or Angels)

Finally Post-season,especially the first round because of the best of 5 series,is more "pitcher" driven than "hitter" driven so Weaker pitching line ups get shown up.

I think a lot of the blame goes to Steinbrenner & his wish to be always involved in trades & signings but the Yankee defeat is the fault of 25 guys who did not perform upto expectations

So if Pinnellia isnt going to NY as Steinbrenner has said Torre is staying, do you think Pinneilla will be coaching somewhere else this year or no? Marlins and Cubs both canned their guys right?

Marlins already have a replacement.

Cubs, Nationals, Giants, and Rangers all need managers.

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Originally Posted by coloradoexpress

I LOVE Joe Torre, but he needs to go. For those of you that were around when he managed the Mets, Cardinals or Braves, you realize that he is not a great "baseball mind".

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I certainly agree, but I think that part of managing is over-rated anyway. I think being able to keep the team all pulling in the same direction and focused is more important, and I don't see that there's anybody around right now that's better at that than Torrre, especially considering all the "stars" and resultant egos the Yankees have.

I'm just left wondering what the definition of a "great 'baseball mind'" is?

It obviously isn't whatever Joe Torre is, that leaves 6,550,093,548 other people to consider :p

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Originally Posted by SirKodiak

It obviously isn't whatever Joe Torre is, that leaves 6,550,093,548 other people to consider :p

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LOL -:D
Minus 1 other (me)

Haha good point Kodiak

lol SK

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Originally Posted by dps

I certainly agree, but I think that part of managing is over-rated anyway. I think being able to keep the team all pulling in the same direction and focused is more important, and I don't see that there's anybody around right now that's better at that than Torrre, especially considering all the "stars" and resultant egos the Yankees have.

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...and you think he's done this??? Do you really believe that the Yankees would have trouble making the playoffs with even 10% of the current managers in baseball?

Dusty Baker, yes. Jim Leyland, yes. Ozzie Guillen, yes. There's 10% :p

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Originally Posted by FRENCHREDSOX

Well he has been in post season nearly every year so winning 120 or 90 games means little (only having Home field advantage as they did this year..)

I'm a Twins fan and they have been in the post season 4 of the last 5 years and I'm not satisfied with that, so how can the Yankees and their fans be satisfied with being "in the post season nearly every year"???

Not always been Cashman's call - also due to the "barren" minor system the Yankees have not been able to "trade" effectively as other teams (like prospect rich Dodgers or Angels)

I realize this and we may never know how much Steinbrenner is involved, but generally you hold your GM responsible for a depleted farm system. Not only that, but you don't need a fruitful farm system if you buy the best players every year (it only hurts if you use poor judgement on the players you deem to be "great").

Finally Post-season,especially the first round because of the best of 5 series,is more "pitcher" driven than "hitter" driven so Weaker pitching line ups get shown up.

Although I tend to agree that having a great pitching staff helps in the short series, without knowing for sure, I would be more than willing to bet that you would not see the better pitching teams coming out of the short series any more than the better hitting teams (just a humble opinion).

I think a lot of the blame goes to Steinbrenner & his wish to be always involved in trades & signings but the Yankee defeat is the fault of 25 guys who did not perform upto expectations

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I can't disagree with this comment...

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Originally Posted by coloradoexpress

...and you think he's done this??? Do you really believe that the Yankees would have trouble making the playoffs with even 10% of the current managers in baseball?

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I meant to say 90%...

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Originally Posted by coloradoexpress

...and you think he's done this??? Do you really believe that the Yankees would have trouble making the playoffs with even 10% of the current managers in baseball?

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The Yankees need a manager who is stable and not easily flustered. Sure, there are other guys like that beside Torre, but I don't see anyone who exhibits those qualities more that Torre. Well, there's Cito Gaston, but then you've gone from "stable and not easily flustered" to "completely detached".